breast reconstruction and the odds of getting lymphoedema

Hi - I am on a waiting list for implants. My concern is that I have had
bilateral breast cancer and bilateral mastectomies and also auxillary node
dissection on both sides as well! A double whammy! I have posted on here
before with other questions relating to breast reconstruction and, as the
date draws closer, I am researching more on the procedure. So my worry now
is wondering whether having this operation puts me at a HIGH risk. What I
suppose I want to know if anyone out there has had this problem going
through with this operation! Its enough worrying about infection, capsular
contracture, rupture and now lymphoedma on both sides!! I am in the
minority with my bilateral cancer. by the way, I didnt have any problems
with the mastectomies except a hematoma and returning back to the operating
table an hour after the op!! Im also thin, a non smoker so I would hope
that would help in my case!
Your thoughts please!!
Mary E.

From what I have learned the major risk for lymphedema is having a node
dissection. Here prior to the dissection they perform sentinel node
biopsy which tells the surgeons where or not to remove more....is that not
offered? Also most women elect to have the implant at time of mastectomy
which allows one recovery period, the exception being if you had to have
radiation post operatively. I have not heard that implants cause lymphedema
although others may tell you otherwise. How long is the wait? Alex




"Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
news:FTjmi.7148$4A1.4700@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Hi - I am on a waiting list for implants. My concern is that I have had
> bilateral breast cancer and bilateral mastectomies and also auxillary node
> dissection on both sides as well! A double whammy! I have posted on here
> before with other questions relating to breast reconstruction and, as the
> date draws closer, I am researching more on the procedure. So my worry
> now is wondering whether having this operation puts me at a HIGH risk.
> What I suppose I want to know if anyone out there has had this problem
> going through with this operation! Its enough worrying about infection,
> capsular contracture, rupture and now lymphoedma on both sides!! I am in
> the minority with my bilateral cancer. by the way, I didnt have any
> problems with the mastectomies except a hematoma and returning back to the
> operating table an hour after the op!! Im also thin, a non smoker so I
> would hope that would help in my case!
> Your thoughts please!!
> Mary E.
>

"Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
news:FTjmi.7148$4A1.4700@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Hi - I am on a waiting list for implants. My concern is that I have had
> bilateral breast cancer and bilateral mastectomies and also auxillary node
> dissection on both sides as well! A double whammy! I have posted on here
> before with other questions relating to breast reconstruction and, as the
> date draws closer, I am researching more on the procedure. So my worry
now
> is wondering whether having this operation puts me at a HIGH risk.
--------------
I had the same worry before I had reconstruction. I asked my breast surgeon
(not the plastic surgeon who did the reconstruction) and my oncologist
whether they had heard of reconstruction increasing your chance of
lymphedema, and they both said no. I also checked the information at
breastcancer.org and didn't find anything mentioning a correlation.

To be truthful with you, Mary, I think that nobody has a clue about why one
woman gets lymphedema and another doesn't. I'm very disappointed in the
lack of hard information out there. All the "recommendations" are
admittedly just guesses.

I did buy a compression sleeve and I wear it whenever I go on an airplane,
but the thing annoys the hell out of me and I can't help wondering if it's
really necessary. Nevertheless, lymphedema is something I'm really afraid
of, so I go on wearing it.

Eva

"Eva" <EvaDStructionNOT@NOTverizon.net> wrote in message
news:cStmi.700$bP4.199@trndny01...
>
> To be truthful with you, Mary, I think that nobody has a clue about why
> one
> woman gets lymphedema and another doesn't. I'm very disappointed in the
> lack of hard information out there. All the "recommendations" are
> admittedly just guesses.
>
> I did buy a compression sleeve and I wear it whenever I go on an airplane,
> but the thing annoys the hell out of me and I can't help wondering if it's
> really necessary. Nevertheless, lymphedema is something I'm really afraid
> of, so I go on wearing it.

I got one, too. I wore it for a while on airplanes, but then found that it
chafed a bit at the top (probably from hefting suitcases with shoulder
straps & stuff like that, but I dunno). Very annoying. Since, I haven't
worn it. So far, no problems.

I think you're right, there's no hard evidence about causes, with the
exception that it seems pretty well established that serious
injury/infection to the affected arm does significantly increase risk (but
still doesn't guarantee one will get it).

So, I avoid the so-called "risk factors" that are easy (no tight elastic,
for example) and ignore the ones that are hard (don't lift anything over 15
pounds -- though that one's pretty well discredited now <g>).

Ann T.
Remove 'dontsendspam' from address to reply by email

Before I had my mastectomy at Kaiser Permanente in Fresno, I was sent
to a nurse who gave me an hour-long lecture on the dangers of lymphedema in
my left arm. (I had eleven nodes removed and no reconstruction.) She told
me all the usual stuff, although I don't remember anything about airplanes.
At any rate, I never used any kind of special sleeve while flying.

That was nearly seven years ago, and I've never had a problem. I've
been lax about some things. For instance, I'm sure I've lifted more than 15
pounds many a time. (I mean, really, am I supposed to weigh the grocery
bags?) Also, although when I go to the doctor I'm very careful to tell
them, put the BP cuff on my right arm, the funny thing is, when I take my
blood pressure at the drug or grocery store, it's got to be with the left
arm (unless I stand on my head, which wouldn't be too practical.)

One thing I've been careful about: I always get shots and whatever in
my right arm. This leads to very overused veins that are so hard to find
that my lab guy now cries, "Miracle!" when the blood starts to flow up the
little tube.

This Oct. 5th I'll be a seven-year cancer survivor. Not bad for a
Stage IIIA!

S.K.

Thank you all for your replies.
I feel more relieved with your comments. I have an appointment with the
plastic surgeon next Wednesday to discuss this problem and the risks
involved. Its double the risk with me due to both arms affected. I
actually helped my husband lift out a small upright freezer from my car
today and it was more than 15 pounds!! I didnt even think twice about
that - and the thought never crossed my mind about that! Oh dear!! Hope
things will be ok there. I have also had blood drawn many times from both
arms - no injections and no blood pressure though.
will let you know what the surgeon thinks!!
Regards,
Mary E.

"SK" <shirleyken@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
news:sHzmi.12182$ya1.2500@news02.roc.ny...
> Before I had my mastectomy at Kaiser Permanente in Fresno, I was sent
> to a nurse who gave me an hour-long lecture on the dangers of lymphedema
> in my left arm. (I had eleven nodes removed and no reconstruction.) She
> told me all the usual stuff, although I don't remember anything about
> airplanes. At any rate, I never used any kind of special sleeve while
> flying.
>
> That was nearly seven years ago, and I've never had a problem. I've
> been lax about some things. For instance, I'm sure I've lifted more than
> 15 pounds many a time. (I mean, really, am I supposed to weigh the
> grocery bags?) Also, although when I go to the doctor I'm very careful to
> tell them, put the BP cuff on my right arm, the funny thing is, when I
> take my blood pressure at the drug or grocery store, it's got to be with
> the left arm (unless I stand on my head, which wouldn't be too practical.)
>
> One thing I've been careful about: I always get shots and whatever in
> my right arm. This leads to very overused veins that are so hard to find
> that my lab guy now cries, "Miracle!" when the blood starts to flow up the
> little tube.
>
> This Oct. 5th I'll be a seven-year cancer survivor. Not bad for a
> Stage IIIA!
>
> S.K.
>

Hi Alex
The surgeon that performed the mastectomies didnt perform this (sentinel
node biopsy) procedure so I had no choice in the matter. Luckily I was node
negative, but also unlucky that I had to go through this dissection
unnecessarily! I couldnt have an immediate reconstruction due to the
unnknown pathology results coming back 5 days later and no surgeon to
perform due to not having health insurance here. I have been on a waiting
list for 1 year, and was advised to WAIT at least 18 months before
reconstruction due to a possible local recurrence. I could be booked in
for reconstruction around the middle to end of August.
Mary E


"alex" <alex@noemail.ctv> wrote in message
news:sf-dnY_NlJH61gfbnZ2dnUVZ_remnZ2d@comcast.com...
> From what I have learned the major risk for lymphedema is having a node
> dissection. Here prior to the dissection they perform sentinel node
> biopsy which tells the surgeons where or not to remove more....is that not
> offered? Also most women elect to have the implant at time of mastectomy
> which allows one recovery period, the exception being if you had to have
> radiation post operatively. I have not heard that implants cause
> lymphedema although others may tell you otherwise. How long is the wait?
> Alex
>
>
>
>
> "Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
> news:FTjmi.7148$4A1.4700@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>> Hi - I am on a waiting list for implants. My concern is that I have had
>> bilateral breast cancer and bilateral mastectomies and also auxillary
>> node dissection on both sides as well! A double whammy! I have posted
>> on here before with other questions relating to breast reconstruction
>> and, as the date draws closer, I am researching more on the procedure.
>> So my worry now is wondering whether having this operation puts me at a
>> HIGH risk. What I suppose I want to know if anyone out there has had this
>> problem going through with this operation! Its enough worrying about
>> infection, capsular contracture, rupture and now lymphoedma on both
>> sides!! I am in the minority with my bilateral cancer. by the way, I
>> didnt have any problems with the mastectomies except a hematoma and
>> returning back to the operating table an hour after the op!! Im also
>> thin, a non smoker so I would hope that would help in my case!
>> Your thoughts please!!
>> Mary E.
>>
>
>

Hi Eva
Yes, I do feel worried as well getting lymphoedema! Did you wear the
compression sleeve on a short hourly flight? And Did you have node
dissection in both arms?
I suppose I do want to go ahead with this reconstruction. My husband feels
things are 'different' due to my 'change' and I suppose I do feel
'uncomfortable' showing my 'deformity' to him. I hope this operation may
make things more 'comfortable' for both of us! Did you have those feelings
as well?
Also, I have put off getting a full time job due to the endless
appointments, tests, chemo etc this past year and seeing as the operation is
just around the corner - i feel i should not wait any longer (I am on top of
the waiting list in the public health system). If I dont go ahead with it
now - I will get a perm. job and would not want to take all this time off.
Not fair for anyone.
Mary E.




"Eva" <EvaDStructionNOT@NOTverizon.net> wrote in message
news:cStmi.700$bP4.199@trndny01...
>
> "Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
> news:FTjmi.7148$4A1.4700@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>> Hi - I am on a waiting list for implants. My concern is that I have had
>> bilateral breast cancer and bilateral mastectomies and also auxillary
>> node
>> dissection on both sides as well! A double whammy! I have posted on
>> here
>> before with other questions relating to breast reconstruction and, as the
>> date draws closer, I am researching more on the procedure. So my worry
> now
>> is wondering whether having this operation puts me at a HIGH risk.
> --------------
> I had the same worry before I had reconstruction. I asked my breast
> surgeon
> (not the plastic surgeon who did the reconstruction) and my oncologist
> whether they had heard of reconstruction increasing your chance of
> lymphedema, and they both said no. I also checked the information at
> breastcancer.org and didn't find anything mentioning a correlation.
>
> To be truthful with you, Mary, I think that nobody has a clue about why
> one
> woman gets lymphedema and another doesn't. I'm very disappointed in the
> lack of hard information out there. All the "recommendations" are
> admittedly just guesses.
>
> I did buy a compression sleeve and I wear it whenever I go on an airplane,
> but the thing annoys the hell out of me and I can't help wondering if it's
> really necessary. Nevertheless, lymphedema is something I'm really afraid
> of, so I go on wearing it.
>
> Eva
>
>

"A.P. Thorsen" <annthorsendontsendspam@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f7eb26$8up$1@news.msu.edu...
>
> "Eva" <EvaDStructionNOT@NOTverizon.net> wrote in message
> news:cStmi.700$bP4.199@trndny01...
>>
>> To be truthful with you, Mary, I think that nobody has a clue about why
>> one
>> woman gets lymphedema and another doesn't. I'm very disappointed in the
>> lack of hard information out there. All the "recommendations" are
>> admittedly just guesses.

I feel that too.
>>
>> I did buy a compression sleeve and I wear it whenever I go on an
>> airplane,
>> but the thing annoys the hell out of me and I can't help wondering if
>> it's
>> really necessary. Nevertheless, lymphedema is something I'm really
>> afraid
>> of, so I go on wearing it.
>
> I got one, too. I wore it for a while on airplanes, but then found that
> it chafed a bit at the top (probably from hefting suitcases with shoulder
> straps & stuff like that, but I dunno). Very annoying. Since, I haven't
> worn it. So far, no problems.

I was supplied with a couple but they were so uncomfortable that I couldn't
bear to wear one, I returned the unused one.
>
> I think you're right, there's no hard evidence about causes, with the
> exception that it seems pretty well established that serious
> injury/infection to the affected arm does significantly increase risk (but
> still doesn't guarantee one will get it).

I've had wuite severe skin and flesh damage to my right arm and so far have
had no ill effects. I suspect that there are more causal factors than are
known. Research continues.
>
> So, I avoid the so-called "risk factors" that are easy (no tight elastic,
> for example) and ignore the ones that are hard (don't lift anything over
> 15 pounds -- though that one's pretty well discredited now <g>).

I realise that I don't even think about it most of the time. When I get a
rose thorn scratch I remember and THEN put on a glove - by which time it
would be too late :-)

It's not good to be so blase about it, I'm certainly not recommending my
idleness. But it's certainly not worrying about getting a scratch or knock,
I couldn't manage to have a good life with my right arem in armour :-)

Mary
>
> Ann T.
> Remove 'dontsendspam' from address to reply by email
>

"Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
news:mBFmi.7537$4A1.2342@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Hi Eva
> Yes, I do feel worried as well getting lymphoedema! Did you wear the
> compression sleeve on a short hourly flight? And Did you have node
> dissection in both arms?
> I suppose I do want to go ahead with this reconstruction. My husband
> feels things are 'different' due to my 'change' and I suppose I do feel
> 'uncomfortable' showing my 'deformity' to him. I hope this operation may
> make things more 'comfortable' for both of us! Did you have those
> feelings as well?

I'm sorry to hear that but try to think of your scars as the evidence of
healing surgery rather than a deformity. I didn't have a mastectomy but my
lumpectomy scar is very evident, My husband often kisses it to show that
he's grateful. If there were no scar to kiss he'd have no wife.

He had a prostatectomy last year for prostate cancer. It's left him either
temporarily or permanently impotent, which is a great loss in our lives -
even at our age. But I'd rather have an impotent husband than be a widow.

Mary

"SK" <shirleyken@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
news:sHzmi.12182$ya1.2500@news02.roc.ny...
>
> That was nearly seven years ago, and I've never had a problem. I've
> been lax about some things. For instance, I'm sure I've lifted more than
> 15 pounds many a time. (I mean, really, am I supposed to weigh the
> grocery bags?)

LOL! I was taught not to have heavy weights dependent on my arm - hanging
from it with my arm straight. So I don't. When I remember ...

> Also, although when I go to the doctor I'm very careful to tell them, put
> the BP cuff on my right arm, the funny thing is, when I take my blood
> pressure at the drug or grocery store, it's got to be with the left arm
> (unless I stand on my head, which wouldn't be too practical.)

But fun for observers :-) Or are you saying that you couldn't stand on your
head? Shame on you!

<smile>
>
> One thing I've been careful about: I always get shots and whatever in
> my right arm. This leads to very overused veins that are so hard to find
> that my lab guy now cries, "Miracle!" when the blood starts to flow up the
> little tube.

I've always told medics that my 'affected' arm mustn't be used for cuffs or
needles, I don't know that it would matter but they like to know about these
things and be seen to make special efforts.
>
> This Oct. 5th I'll be a seven-year cancer survivor. Not bad for a
> Stage IIIA!

Excellent! In June I'll be a nine year but I don't know what my stage was
....

Mary
>
> S.K.
>

"Mary Fisher" <mary.fisher@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:469b36f5$0$22019$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet. net...
>
>
> I've had ... severe skin and flesh damage to my right arm and so far have
> had no ill effects. I suspect that there are more causal factors than are
> known. Research continues.
----------------
Does it really? Are there really any researchers out there studying what
causes lymphedema? You'd think they would have come up with *something* by
now.

Eva

"Eva" <EvaDStructionNOT@NOTverizon.net> wrote in message
news:v4Imi.6218$7R4.2814@trndny09...
>
> "Mary Fisher" <mary.fisher@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:469b36f5$0$22019$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet. net...
>>
>>
>> I've had ... severe skin and flesh damage to my right arm and so far have
>> had no ill effects. I suspect that there are more causal factors than are
>> known. Research continues.
> ----------------
> Does it really? Are there really any researchers out there studying what
> causes lymphedema? You'd think they would have come up with *something*
> by
> now.

LOL! Apparently the old adage about putting men on the moon but not being
able to cure the common cold is still true :-)

My lympho specialist nurses have told me that research is ongoing. I suspect
that dealing with cancer itself is given more time, and rightly so when
resources are limited ...

Mary

Hello Mary,

> I'm sorry to hear that but try to think of your scars as the evidence of
> healing surgery rather than a deformity. I didn't have a mastectomy but my
> lumpectomy scar is very evident, My husband often kisses it to show that
> he's grateful. If there were no scar to kiss he'd have no wife.
>

My huband also believes that my mastectomy is the surgery that saved my life
and seems completely unaffected by appearance. (I've had reconstruction,
but that was totally my choice and had little to do with my feelings of
desirability or his romantic interest).


> He had a prostatectomy last year for prostate cancer. It's left him either
> temporarily or permanently impotent, which is a great loss in our lives -
> even at our age. But I'd rather have an impotent husband than be a widow.
>

Well said, Mary. I'd like to think I'd have the same reaction if my husband
were to have the same.


> Mary
>Barb

Hi Mary E.,

My breast surgery and reconstruction were 24 and 23 years ago, and I also
had axillary node dissection. (They weren't doing sentinel node surgery
then). I have trouble remembering how many nodes were actually removed, but
I'm pretty sure it was more than 16. (Nine were malignant and the malignant
total was one more than half of those removed. That's how they decided on
length of chemo treatment). Anyway, I have a fairly large underarm scar
and have had numbness under my armpit and down my arm since surgery. I
never had any trouble with lymphedema, however I was cautioned about
needles and blood pressure cuffs, so I have complied. No one ever told me
not to lift, so I've never been careful of that.

I wish you well with your reconstruction. I've not been sorry I had it
done. For me, it was about convenience. My husband was never concerned
with my lopsidedness. I recall that my plastic surgeon was very clear about
my having reasonable expectations concerning how the reconstruction would
look. I"m glad he had me thinking about it, because it's not a "match" to
my natural breast. I does mostly fill a bra cup and is more convenient for
me than a prosthesis.

Best wishes to you. Let us know how it is going for you.

Barb

Im sorry to hear about your husband Eva. Sometimes I become self centred
with my journey.
I am comfortable with my scars its just bearing it to my husband.
Mary E.

"Mary Fisher" <mary.fisher@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:469b38ea$0$22019$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet. net...
>
> "Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
> news:mBFmi.7537$4A1.2342@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>> Hi Eva
>> Yes, I do feel worried as well getting lymphoedema! Did you wear the
>> compression sleeve on a short hourly flight? And Did you have node
>> dissection in both arms?
>> I suppose I do want to go ahead with this reconstruction. My husband
>> feels things are 'different' due to my 'change' and I suppose I do feel
>> 'uncomfortable' showing my 'deformity' to him. I hope this operation may
>> make things more 'comfortable' for both of us! Did you have those
>> feelings as well?
>
> I'm sorry to hear that but try to think of your scars as the evidence of
> healing surgery rather than a deformity. I didn't have a mastectomy but my
> lumpectomy scar is very evident, My husband often kisses it to show that
> he's grateful. If there were no scar to kiss he'd have no wife.
>
> He had a prostatectomy last year for prostate cancer. It's left him either
> temporarily or permanently impotent, which is a great loss in our lives -
> even at our age. But I'd rather have an impotent husband than be a widow.
>
> Mary
>

Thanks Barb.
I appreciate your feedback. Will have more information next Wednesday 25th
July when I visit my surgeon. Will keep you all posted.
Mary E.

"Barb" <ammerman@epix.net> wrote in message
news:KYImi.11244$Oc.292702@news1.epix.net...
> Hi Mary E.,
>
> My breast surgery and reconstruction were 24 and 23 years ago, and I also
> had axillary node dissection. (They weren't doing sentinel node surgery
> then). I have trouble remembering how many nodes were actually removed,
> but I'm pretty sure it was more than 16. (Nine were malignant and the
> malignant total was one more than half of those removed. That's how they
> decided on length of chemo treatment). Anyway, I have a fairly large
> underarm scar and have had numbness under my armpit and down my arm since
> surgery. I never had any trouble with lymphedema, however I was
> cautioned about needles and blood pressure cuffs, so I have complied. No
> one ever told me not to lift, so I've never been careful of that.
>
> I wish you well with your reconstruction. I've not been sorry I had it
> done. For me, it was about convenience. My husband was never concerned
> with my lopsidedness. I recall that my plastic surgeon was very clear
> about my having reasonable expectations concerning how the reconstruction
> would look. I"m glad he had me thinking about it, because it's not a
> "match" to my natural breast. I does mostly fill a bra cup and is more
> convenient for me than a prosthesis.
>
> Best wishes to you. Let us know how it is going for you.
>
> Barb
>

"Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
news:t1Fmi.7515$4A1.1005@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Thank you all for your replies.
> I feel more relieved with your comments. I have an appointment with the
> plastic surgeon next Wednesday to discuss this problem and the risks
> involved. Its double the risk with me due to both arms affected. I
> actually helped my husband lift out a small upright freezer from my car
> today and it was more than 15 pounds!! I didnt even think twice about
> that - and the thought never crossed my mind about that! Oh dear!! Hope
> things will be ok there.

Let me just be clear about what I was saying: The "cautions lists" for
lymphedema used to have "don't lift more than x pounds" (usually 10 or 15)
as one of the items to avoid. After my surgery (almost 7 years ago) I did
as much research as my non-medical-specialist but academically kinda
competent skills would allow, and found NO evidence supporting the idea that
lifting caused lymphedema.

In fact, I found some evidence suggesting that lifting was NOT a risk
factor, though those studies were of relatively low quality (retrospective
studies, and meta-analyses, for example).

More recently, there has been solider research (prospective, controlled)
that's concluded that repetitive upper-body weight-bearing exercise (rowing,
dragon boating, weight training) is NOT a risk factor for lymphedema, and
MAY even help prevent it.

There is some evidence that injury to the arm IS a risk factor. Thus, if
lifting unaccustomed amounts of weight actually caused an injury, perhaps
that could be risky -- but I'm speculating when I say that.

So, my personal opinion is that there's no good reason to worry about
lifting, as long as you don't risk injuring yourself (which you probably
wanted to avoid anyway, even if you'd never had lymph nodes removed).

Some of the "cautions lists" still list lifting as a risk, but I think it's
reasonable to say they're outdated (antique, primitive . . . . <G>).

Does anyone have solid evidence to the contrary?

Ann T.
Remove 'dontsendspam' from address to reply by email

"A.P. Thorsen" <annthorsendontsendspam@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f7h8q7$evl$1@news.msu.edu...
> "Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
> news:t1Fmi.7515$4A1.1005@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>> Thank you all for your replies.
>> I feel more relieved with your comments. I have an appointment with
>> the plastic surgeon next Wednesday to discuss this problem and the risks
>> involved. Its double the risk with me due to both arms affected. I
>> actually helped my husband lift out a small upright freezer from my car
>> today and it was more than 15 pounds!! I didnt even think twice about
>> that - and the thought never crossed my mind about that! Oh dear!! Hope
>> things will be ok there.
>
> Let me just be clear about what I was saying: The "cautions lists" for
> lymphedema used to have "don't lift more than x pounds" (usually 10 or 15)
> as one of the items to avoid. After my surgery (almost 7 years ago) I
> did as much research as my non-medical-specialist but academically kinda
> competent skills would allow, and found NO evidence supporting the idea
> that lifting caused lymphedema.
>
> In fact, I found some evidence suggesting that lifting was NOT a risk
> factor, though those studies were of relatively low quality (retrospective
> studies, and meta-analyses, for example).
>
> More recently, there has been solider research (prospective, controlled)
> that's concluded that repetitive upper-body weight-bearing exercise
> (rowing, dragon boating, weight training) is NOT a risk factor for
> lymphedema, and MAY even help prevent it.
>
> There is some evidence that injury to the arm IS a risk factor. Thus, if
> lifting unaccustomed amounts of weight actually caused an injury, perhaps
> that could be risky -- but I'm speculating when I say that.
>
> So, my personal opinion is that there's no good reason to worry about
> lifting, as long as you don't risk injuring yourself (which you probably
> wanted to avoid anyway, even if you'd never had lymph nodes removed).
>
> Some of the "cautions lists" still list lifting as a risk, but I think
> it's reasonable to say they're outdated (antique, primitive . . . . <G>).
>
> Does anyone have solid evidence to the contrary?

No, and my gut reaction is that you're right.

Mary

Your comments sound very logical!
Mary E.
"Mary Fisher" <mary.fisher@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:469cba0f$0$22489$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet. net...
>
> "A.P. Thorsen" <annthorsendontsendspam@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:f7h8q7$evl$1@news.msu.edu...
>> "Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
>> news:t1Fmi.7515$4A1.1005@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>>> Thank you all for your replies.
>>> I feel more relieved with your comments. I have an appointment with
>>> the plastic surgeon next Wednesday to discuss this problem and the risks
>>> involved. Its double the risk with me due to both arms affected. I
>>> actually helped my husband lift out a small upright freezer from my car
>>> today and it was more than 15 pounds!! I didnt even think twice about
>>> that - and the thought never crossed my mind about that! Oh dear!!
>>> Hope things will be ok there.
>>
>> Let me just be clear about what I was saying: The "cautions lists" for
>> lymphedema used to have "don't lift more than x pounds" (usually 10 or
>> 15) as one of the items to avoid. After my surgery (almost 7 years
>> ago) I did as much research as my non-medical-specialist but academically
>> kinda competent skills would allow, and found NO evidence supporting the
>> idea that lifting caused lymphedema.
>>
>> In fact, I found some evidence suggesting that lifting was NOT a risk
>> factor, though those studies were of relatively low quality
>> (retrospective studies, and meta-analyses, for example).
>>
>> More recently, there has been solider research (prospective, controlled)
>> that's concluded that repetitive upper-body weight-bearing exercise
>> (rowing, dragon boating, weight training) is NOT a risk factor for
>> lymphedema, and MAY even help prevent it.
>>
>> There is some evidence that injury to the arm IS a risk factor. Thus,
>> if lifting unaccustomed amounts of weight actually caused an injury,
>> perhaps that could be risky -- but I'm speculating when I say that.
>>
>> So, my personal opinion is that there's no good reason to worry about
>> lifting, as long as you don't risk injuring yourself (which you probably
>> wanted to avoid anyway, even if you'd never had lymph nodes removed).
>>
>> Some of the "cautions lists" still list lifting as a risk, but I think
>> it's reasonable to say they're outdated (antique, primitive . . . . <G>).
>>
>> Does anyone have solid evidence to the contrary?
>
> No, and my gut reaction is that you're right.
>
> Mary
>
>

"Mary E." <happy@home.com> wrote in message
news:eZRmi.7727$4A1.6102@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Im sorry to hear about your husband Eva. Sometimes I become self centred
> with my journey.
---------------
Er, that was Mary F. whose husband had prostate surgery. I don't have a
husband!
-----------------
> I am comfortable with my scars its just bearing it to my husband.
-----------------
I know what you mean. I don't have a husband but I do have a boyfriend.
Before I had reconstruction I always wanted to leave my shirt on. He told
me I didn't have to do it (reconstruction) for him. He said "If I were you
I wouldn't want to put myself through any more surgery." I was glad he said
that, because this way I never have to feel like I had to have
reconstruction to make him happy. I know it was really for me, not for him.

Eva