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  #1  
Old 06-18-2009, 05:14 AM
Califchief
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Default HERBS

Herbs and cancer drugs - They may not mix
January 2008

Many people with cancer turn to dietary supplements such as antioxidant
vitamins as well as to plants and plant products. They believe that these
may help them fight their disease or counter the side effects of
conventional therapies.

This practice concerns cancer experts. Although we tend to think of herbs as
"natural" and harmless, in fact they can alter the absorption, distribution,
metabolism, and excretion of prescribed drugs. In short, they may interfere
with cancer treatment.

Where the problem lies
Many adverse drug interactions revolve around a group of body enzymes,
called the P450 system, that play a role in the metabolism of most of the
commonly prescribed anti-cancer drugs. If a person taking one of these drugs
also uses certain herbal preparations, that might increase the enzymes'
activity, resulting in a decrease in the drug's concentration and thus a
reduction of its effectiveness. On the other hand, the opposite may happen:
The potency of an anti-cancer drug may rise to toxic levels, much like an
overdose.

The bottom line for cancer patients: Check with your doctor before you take
any herb or supplement.


From the Journal of Clinical Oncology and the National Cancer Institute
Living with Cancer
Health monitor
January 2008

___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
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  #2  
Old 06-19-2009, 07:05 PM
prostwell
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Default Re: HERBS

The only problem with this advice, "consult your doctor about the
herbal suppliments you're using", is that most doctors are not as
informed about herbal and traditional medicines, their mechanisms of
action, or, in many cases, even their names, as they are about
commercial allopathic chemicals.

Case in point, I just returned from my doctor and asked about use of
Gingko Bilboa before surgery to reduce the effects of scarring tissue
during recovery.

She had not even heard of Gingko, and the advice always seems to be
negative - don't do this and don't do that - based more on lack of
knowledge or medical statistical "studies".

But your post does make a good point - find out as much as you can
about whether an herbal medicine interferes with a drug you may be
prescribed, but you may not be able to rely on the doctor for
knowledge of herbal treatments. It pays to educate yourself - or
consult a qualified naturopath who may have the necessary expertise.
..
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  #3  
Old 06-19-2009, 11:01 PM
Heather
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Default Re: HERBS

See below..

"prostwell" <prostwell@westernwares.com> wrote in message
news:2d560165-da00-4bff-baff-e2e9d3791c2e@w9g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>
> Case in point, I just returned from my doctor and asked about use of
> Gingko Bilboa before surgery to reduce the effects of scarring tissue
> during recovery.
>
> She had not even heard of Gingko, and the advice always seems to be
> negative - don't do this and don't do that - based more on lack of
> knowledge or medical statistical "studies".


Gingko Biloba (sp) is not used for reducing scarring......it is for
memory loss, tinnitus and assorted other things. I double checked
online and was surprised to see the following....

quote.....
There are some data to suggest that ginkgo can increase bleeding risk,
so people who take anticoagulant drugs, have bleeding disorders, or have
scheduled surgery or dental procedures should use caution and talk to a
health care provider if using ginkgo.
unquote.....

So perhaps you were lucky that your doctor didn't know much about it.
The only two I would use to speed up healing of scars after the surgery
would be Vitamin E (both internally and externally) and aloe gel.
(externally)

HTH.....Heather

PS...I tried it for memory and it didn't work.....if I recall correctly
(G).


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  #4  
Old 06-19-2009, 11:01 PM
toledo
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Default Re: HERBS

On 6/20/09 12:06 AM, in article h1h24e$o8d$1@news.eternal-september.org,
"Heather" <no.one@home.invalid> wrote:

> See below..
>
> "prostwell" <prostwell@westernwares.com> wrote in message
> news:2d560165-da00-4bff-baff-e2e9d3791c2e@w9g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> Case in point, I just returned from my doctor and asked about use of
>> Gingko Bilboa before surgery to reduce the effects of scarring tissue
>> during recovery.
>>
>> She had not even heard of Gingko, and the advice always seems to be
>> negative - don't do this and don't do that - based more on lack of
>> knowledge or medical statistical "studies".


The correct advice is don't use herbal stuff unless there's evidence it is
effective and has no adverse effects.
>
> Gingko Biloba (sp) is not used for reducing scarring......it is for
> memory loss, tinnitus and assorted other things. I double checked
> online and was surprised to see the following....


"Double checking" online???
>
> quote.....
> There are some data to suggest that ginkgo can increase bleeding risk,
> so people who take anticoagulant drugs, have bleeding disorders, or have
> scheduled surgery or dental procedures should use caution and talk to a
> health care provider if using ginkgo.
> unquote.....
>
> So perhaps you were lucky that your doctor didn't know much about it.
> The only two I would use to speed up healing of scars after the surgery
> would be Vitamin E (both internally and externally) and aloe gel.
> (externally)
>
> HTH.....Heather
>
> PS...I tried it for memory and it didn't work.....if I recall correctly
> (G).
>
>


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  #5  
Old 06-19-2009, 11:41 PM
Heather
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: HERBS


"toledo" <toledo@rmc.mc> wrote in message
news:C661DD2A.589B1%toledo@rmc.mc...
> On 6/20/09 12:06 AM, in article
> h1h24e$o8d$1@news.eternal-september.org,
> "Heather" <no.one@home.invalid> wrote:
>
>> Gingko Biloba (sp) is not used for reducing scarring......it is for
>> memory loss, tinnitus and assorted other things. I double checked
>> online and was surprised to see the following....

>
> "Double checking" online???


You having a problem with English?? I was checking my own information
with Wikipedia, etc online. Got it??

I couldn't be bothered to run a trace on you......probably Safire's sock
puppet.


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  #6  
Old 06-20-2009, 12:46 AM
prostwell
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: HERBS

> HTH.....Heather
>
> PS...I tried it for memory and it didn't work.....if I recall correctly
> (G).


Heather,

Actually, I guess *I* might need this for memory <g>

In my post, I meant to reference Gotu Kola (not Gingko), which is the
herb that has been shown to reduce scarring.
(yes, I *did* ask my doctor about Gotu Kola, not Gingko :-) )

Sorry for the confusion caused by my post.

"Gotu Kola is an herbal product that promotes wound healing by
stimulating the manufacture of structural proteins like collagen. Gotu
Kola has demonstrated impressive clinical results in promoting wound
repair. The types of wounds healed include surgical wounds..."
- Dr. Michael Murray, "How to Prevent and Treat Cancer with Natural
Medicine"

I plan to take this *after* surgery, and take no supplements for a
week *before* surgery, in case they might interfere with the
anesthesia.
(This is my doctor's advice and it makes sense to me.)
I'll also add Vitamin E for healing *after* surgery, as you suggest.
(Vitamin E is a blood thinner and should *definitely* not be taken
before surgery.)

The actual point I was trying to make in my post is simply that
doctors need to be more informed about herbal medicine, just as they
are about commercial medicines, and not just dismiss them all out of
ignorance.

-Rick
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  #7  
Old 06-20-2009, 04:04 AM
Heather
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: HERBS


"prostwell" <prostwell@westernwares.com> wrote in message
news:17b95747-440c-430d-b477-e555a6c7b420@k20g2000vbp.googlegroups.com...
>
> Actually, I guess *I* might need this for memory <g>
>
> In my post, I meant to reference Gotu Kola (not Gingko), which is the
> herb that has been shown to reduce scarring.
> (yes, I *did* ask my doctor about Gotu Kola, not Gingko :-) )
>
> Sorry for the confusion caused by my post.
>
> "Gotu Kola is an herbal product that promotes wound healing by
> stimulating the manufacture of structural proteins like collagen. Gotu
> Kola has demonstrated impressive clinical results in promoting wound
> repair. The types of wounds healed include surgical wounds..."
> - Dr. Michael Murray, "How to Prevent and Treat Cancer with Natural
> Medicine"


OK......never heard of it, to be honest. But Ron and I have taken
several mega vitamins for 30 years or more. When he went in for
radiation, he had to stop them all.....especially Vitamin E.....because
it is an anti-oxidant and might interfere with the radiation.

And the doctors should be more informed, but I ask my pharmacist
instead!! For both prescriptions from the doctors and for alternative
pills or potions. I happen to be quite allergic/sensitive to a lot of
stuff and right now for instance, the family doctor put me on a blood
pressure pill. I held off for a year, but it was getting a tad high.
In 3 weeks, I have now tried two of them....having problems with both.
The first one didn't work at all and made me dizzy as a coot.....this
one is causing edema in my ankles, which is on the list of "50 rare side
effects"........wry grin.

Heather
>
> I plan to take this *after* surgery, and take no supplements for a
> week *before* surgery, in case they might interfere with the
> anesthesia.
> (This is my doctor's advice and it makes sense to me.)
> I'll also add Vitamin E for healing *after* surgery, as you suggest.
> (Vitamin E is a blood thinner and should *definitely* not be taken
> before surgery.)
>
> The actual point I was trying to make in my post is simply that
> doctors need to be more informed about herbal medicine, just as they
> are about commercial medicines, and not just dismiss them all out of
> ignorance.
>
> -Rick



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  #8  
Old 06-20-2009, 10:09 AM
kh
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: HERBS

On Jun 17, 2:51*pm, califch...@fidotel.com (Califchief) wrote:

> Herbs and cancer drugs - They may not mix
> January 2008


Anyone care to summarize herbs ( which I pronounce erbs, don't know
where Martha Stewart gets her H-herbs from) and PCa.

As detailed in other threads, the Wizard of JHU is treating me with
chemo and a handful of pills to augment, alleviate, and block the side
effects. Cytoxan, Decadron, Oxycodone, Prevacid, Lasik, and a
supporting cast of potassium, calcium w/ D, and a multivitamin.

Curcumin, turmeric, hot peppers/Capsaicin, broccoli(what's in it),
tofu/soy, blueberries, pomegranate, green tea, what's the story,
where do you get it, how do you prepare it, and how much, etc?

I'm not expecting herbs to cure me but if I can get a slight edge by
making hot szcheuan tofu/broccoli occasionally and drink my home-made
green tea with blueberry and pomegranate juice, why not?

What are you doing on the herbal front?

-kh turmeric-cheese, now that'd be a product.
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  #9  
Old 06-20-2009, 11:23 AM
rosbif
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: HERBS

On Sat, 20 Jun 2009 03:03:36 -0700 (PDT), kh <tchtic@yahoo.com> wrote:

>-kh turmeric-cheese, now that'd be a product.


I've only recently spotted also the turmeric/anti-alzheimers
connection.

Maybe it was mentioned here before? (if so, i'm not getting enough
turmeric).

Curried chicken can take quite a lot of turmeric before it starts to
dominate the flavour.
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  #10  
Old 06-20-2009, 05:35 PM
J
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Gotu Kola (was Re: HERBS

prostwell wrote:

> > HTH.....Heather
> >
> > PS...I tried it for memory and it didn't work.....if I recall correctly
> > (G).

>
> Heather,
>
> Actually, I guess *I* might need this for memory <g>
>
> In my post, I meant to reference Gotu Kola (not Gingko), which is the
> herb that has been shown to reduce scarring.
> (yes, I *did* ask my doctor about Gotu Kola, not Gingko :-) )
>
> Sorry for the confusion caused by my post.
>
> "Gotu Kola is an herbal product that promotes wound healing by
> stimulating the manufacture of structural proteins like collagen. Gotu
> Kola has demonstrated impressive clinical results in promoting wound
> repair. The types of wounds healed include surgical wounds..."
> - Dr. Michael Murray, "How to Prevent and Treat Cancer with Natural
> Medicine"
>
> I plan to take this *after* surgery, and take no supplements for a
> week *before* surgery, in case they might interfere with the
> anesthesia.


The topical is claimed to reduce scarring.
J
http://www.umm.edu/altmed/articles/gotu-kola-000253.htm
Gotu kola
Overview:

Gotu kola (Centella asiatica) has been used as a medicinal herb for thousands
of years in India, China, and Indonesia. It was used to heal wounds, improve
mental clarity, and treat skin conditions such as leprosy and psoriasis. Some
people use it to treat respiratory infections such as colds, and it has a
history of use for that purpose in China. It has been called "the fountain of
life" because legend has it that an ancient Chinese herbalist lived for more
than 200 years as a result of using the herb.

Historically, gotu kola has also been used to treat syphilis, hepatitis,
stomach ulcers, mental fatigue, epilepsy, diarrhea, fever, and asthma. Today,
American and European herbalists use gotu kola most often to treat chronic
venous insufficiency (a condition where blood pools in the legs). It's also
used in ointments to treat psoriasis and help heal minor wounds.

Gotu kola should not be confused with kola nut (Cola nitida). Unlike kola
nut, gotu kola has no caffeine, and is not a stimulant.
Plant Description:

Gotu kola is a perennial plant native to India, Japan, China, Indonesia,
South Africa, Sri Lanka, and the South Pacific. A member of the parsley
family, it is tasteless and odorless. It thrives in and around water. It has
small fan-shaped green leaves with white or light purple-to-pink flowers, and
it bears small oval fruit. The leaves and stems of the gotu kola plant are
used for medicinal purposes.
Medicinal Uses and Indications:
Treatment

Venous insufficiency and varicose veins

When blood vessels lose their elasticity, blood pools in the legs and fluid
leaks out of the blood vessels. That causes the legs to swell (venous
insufficiency). Several small studies suggest gotu kola may help reduce
swelling and improve circulation. In a study of 94 people with venous
insufficiency, those who took gotu kola had a significant improvement in
symptoms compared to those who took placebo. In another study of people with
varicose veins, ultrasound tests showed improvements in the vascular tone
(meaning there was less leakage) of those who took gotu kola.

Wound healing and skin lesions

Gotu kola contains chemicals called triterpenoids. In animal and lab studies,
these compounds appear to help heal wounds. For example, some studies
indicate that triterpenoids strengthen the skin, boost antioxidants in
wounds, and increase blood supply to the area. Based on these findings, gotu
kola has been used topically (applied to the skin) for minor burns,
psoriasis, prevention of scar formation following surgery, and prevention or
reduction of stretch marks.

You can find gotu kola in many topical preparations for wound healing. Ask
your health care provider.

Anxiety

Triterpenoids (the compounds found in gotu kola) seem to decrease anxiety and
increase mental function in mice. One human study found that people who took
gotu kola were less likely to be startled by a new noise than those who took
placebo. Since the "startle noise" response can be an indicator of anxiety,
researchers theorize that gotu kola might help reduce anxiety symptoms. But
the dose used in this study was very high, so it's impossible to say how gotu
kola might be used to treat anxiety.

Scleroderma

A single study of 13 women with scleroderma found that gotu kola decreased
joint pain and skin hardening, and improved finger movement.

Insomnia

Gotu kola acts as a sedative when given to animals in tests. Because of that
effect, it is sometimes suggested to help people with insomnia. But no human
studies have been done to see whether it works and whether it's safe.
Dosage and Administration:

Gotu kola is available in teas and as dried herbs, tinctures, capsules,
tablets, and ointments. Products should be stored in a cool, dry place and
used before the expiration date on the label.
Pediatric

Gotu kola is not recommended for those under 18 years old.

Adult
The adult dosage of gotu kola varies depending on the condition being
treated. Your health care provider can help you choose the right dose for
you.

The standard dose of gotu kola (Centella asiatica) varies depending on the
preparation. Most studies have used standardized extracts:

* Dried herb -- you can make a tea of the dried leaf, three times daily.
* Powdered herb (available in capsules) -- 1,000 - 4,000 mg, three times
a day
* Tincture (1:2 w/v, 30 % alcohol) 30 - 60 drops (equivalent to 1.5 - 3
mL -- there are 5 mL in a teaspoon), three times daily.
* Standardized extract -- 50 - 250 mg, two to three times daily.
Standardized extracts should contain 40 % asiaticoside, 29 - 30 % asiatic
acid, 29 - 30 % madecassic acid, and 1 - 2 % madecassoside. Doses used in
studies mentioned in the Treatment section range from 20 mg (for scleroderma)
up to 180 mg (in one study for venous insufficiency, although most of the
studies for this condition were conducted using 90 - 120 mg daily).

Precautions:

Gotu kola has been used in some studies that lasted up to one year. However,
in some people gotu kola may affect the liver. It's best not to use gotu kola
for more than 6 weeks without talking to your doctor. You may need to take a
2-week break before taking the herb again.

Asiaticoside, a major component of gotu kola, has also been associated with
tumor growth in mice. Anyone with a history of precancerous or cancerous skin
lesions -- such as squamous cell, basal cell skin cancer, or melanoma --
should not use gotu kola.

People with liver disease, or who take medications that affect the liver,
should not take gotu kola.
Side Effects

Side effects are rare but may include skin allergy and burning sensations
(with external use), headache, stomach upset, nausea, dizziness, and extreme
drowsiness. These side effects tend to occur with high doses of gotu kola.
Women

Women who are pregnant or trying to become pregnant should not use gotu kola,
because animal studies have shown a reduction in fertility after taking gotu
kola. Researchers don't know whether gotu kola is safe to take when you are
breast-feeding, so nursing mothers should avoid it.
Pediatric Use

Gotu kola is not recommended for children.

Geriatric Use

People older than 65 should take gotu kola at a lower than standard dose.
Your health care provider can help you determine the right dose for you,
which can be increased slowly over time.
Interactions and Depletions:

Gotu kola may interact with the following medications:

Cholesterol-lowering drugs (including statins) -- In animal studies, gotu
kola increased cholesterol levels. It may also raise cholesterol levels in
humans, although no studies have been done.

Diabetes medications -- In animal studies, gotu kola seems to increase blood
sugar levels. People with diabetes should not take gotu kola without first
talking to their doctor.

Diuretics (water pills) -- Gotu kola appears to have diuretic effects,
meaning it helps rid the body of excess fluid. Taking diuretic medications
and gotu kola could cause your body to lose too much fluid, upsetting the
balance of electrolytes you need. The same is true of taking gotu kola with
herbs that have diuretic effects, such as green tea, astragalus, or gingko.

Sedatives -- Because of gotu kola's sedative effects, it might increase the
effect of other medications taken to relieve anxiety or insomnia. It might
also increase the effects of herbs taken for anxiety or insomnia, such as
valerian.
Alternative Names:

Brahmi; Centella; Centella asiatica; Hydrocotyle; Indian pennywort; Luei gong
gen; Marsh pennywort

* Reviewed last on: 12/16/2008
* Steven D. Ehrlich, NMD, private practice specializing in complementary
and alternative medicine, Phoenix, AZ. Review provided by VeriMed Healthcare
Network.

Supporting Research

Antani JA, Kulkarni RD, Antani NJ. Effect of abana on ventricular function in
ischemic heart disease. Jpn Heart J. Nov 1990: 829-835.

Anonymous. Centella asiatica (Gotu kola). Botanical Monograph. American
Journal of Natural Medicine. 1996;3(6):22-26.

Ahshawat MS, Saraf S, Saraf S. Preparation and characterization of herbal
creams for improvement of skin viscoelastic properties. Int J Cosmet Sci.
2008 Jun;30(3):183-93.

Belcaro GV, Rulo A, Grimaldi R. Capillary filtration and ankle edema in
patients with venous hypertension treated with TTFCA. Angiology.
1990;41(1):12-18.

Biswas TK, Mukherjee B. Plant medicines of Indian origin for wound healing
activity: a review. Int J Low Extrem Wounds. 2003;2(1):25-39.

Bradwejn J, Zhou Y, Koszycki D, Shlik J. A double-blind, placebo-controlled
study on the effects of Gotu Kola (Centella asiatica) on acoustic startle
response in healthy subjects. J ClinPsychopharmacol. 2000;20(6):680-684.

Brinker F. Herb Contraindications and Drug Interactions. 3rd ed. Sandy, Or:
Eclectic Medical Publication; 2001.

Brinkhaus B, Linder M, Schuppan D, Hahn EG. Chemical, pharmacological and
clinical profile of the East Asian medical plant Centella asiatica. Phytomed.
2000;7(5):427-448.

Cauffield JS, Forbes HJM. Dietary supplements used in the treatment of
depression, anxiety, and sleep disorders. Lippincotts Prim Care Pract.
1999:3(3):290-304.

DerMarderosian A, ed. Gotu Kola. In: Facts and Comparisons The Review of
Natural Products. 5th ed. Philadelphia, Pa: Lippincott Williams & Wilkins;
2008

Fetrow C, Avila J. Professional's Handbook of Complementary & Alternative
Medicines. 2nd ed. Philadelphia, Pa: Lippincott Williams & Wilkins; 2001

Ivanov V, Ivanova S, Kalinovsky T, Niedzwiecki A, Rath M. Plant-derived
micronutrients suppress monocyte adhesion to cultured human aortic
endothelial cell layer by modulating its extracellular matrix composition. J
Cardiovasc Pharmacol. 2008 Jul;52(1):55-65.

Kuhn M, Winston D. Herbal Therapy and Supplements: A Scientific and
Traditional Approach. Philadelphia, Pa: Lippincott; 2001.

LaValle JB, Krinsky DL, Hawkins EB, et al. Natural Therapeutics Pocket Guide.
Hudson, OH:LexiComp; 2000: 449-450.

McGuffin M, Hobbs C, Upton R, eds. American Herbal Products Association's
Botanical Safety Handbook. Boca Raton, FL: CRC Press; 1997.

Pointel JP, Boccalon H, Cloarec M, Ledevehat C, Joubert M. Titrated extract
of centella asiatica (TECA) in the treatment of venous insufficiency of the
lower limbs. Angiology 1987;38(1 Pt 1):46-50.

Shukla A, Rasik AM, Dhawan BN. Asiaticoside-induced elevation of antioxidant
levels in healing wounds. Phytother Res. 1999;13(1):50-54.

Singh RH, Narsimhamurthy K, Singh G. Neuronutrient impact of Ayurvedic
Rasayana therapy in brain aging. Biogerontology. 2008 Dec;9(6):369-74.

Subathra M, Shila S, Devi MA, Panneerselvam C. Emerging role of Centella
asiatica in improving age-related neurological antioxidant status. Exp
Gerontol. 2005;40(8-9):707-15.

Wollina U, Abdel-Nasar MB, Mani R. A review of the microcirculation in skin
in patients with chronic venous insufficiency: the problem and the evidence
available for therapeutic options. Int J Low Extrem Wounds. 2006;5(3):169-80.

Wojcikowski K, Wohlmuth H, Johnson DW, Rolfe M, Gobe G. An in vitro
investigation of herbs traditionally used for kidney and urinary system
disorders: Potential therapeutic and toxic effects. Nephrology (Carlton).
2008 Sep 22. [Epub ahead of print].


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