Short Term Memory

I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any suggestions
for short term memory excersizes or techniques?

Felmer Dingle aka WhiteSoxFan

On Mon, 05 May 2008 14:08:41 -0500, Felmer Dingle <Felmer@gmail.com>
wrote:

>I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
>do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any suggestions
>for short term memory excersizes or techniques?
>
>Felmer Dingle aka WhiteSoxFan

I carry a small, shirt pocket size notebook and a pen and try to write
down everything. Funny thing, though, right now I can't find the
notebook and can't remember where I had it last. True situation!

I know the ADT made my memory problems much worse. I don't know if
they are still bad because of the ADT or I'm just getting older -
probably both.

Good luck.
Burney
RP in 1995 (age 52)
RT in 2000
ADT (Casodex) 10/06 - 8/07
Latest PSA - 0.18

Felmer Dingle wrote:
> I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
> do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any suggestions
> for short term memory excersizes or techniques?

Not on a statin, are you?

I.P.

Easier to get a new wife :-))

On Mon, 05 May 2008 14:40:54 -0700, "I.P. Freely"
<fuhgheddaboutit@noway.nohow> wrote:

>Felmer Dingle wrote:
>> I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
>> do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any suggestions
>> for short term memory excersizes or techniques?
>
>Not on a statin, are you?
>
>I.P.

On Mon, 05 May 2008 14:40:54 -0700, I.P. Freely wrote:

> Felmer Dingle wrote:
>> I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
>> do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any
>> suggestions for short term memory excersizes or techniques?
>
> Not on a statin, are you?
>
> I.P.

I.P., could you cite chapter & verse on that? I am on a statin and have
some trouble with short-term memory; same for my wife. We thought it was
just due to getting older... I'll try google but if you can suggest a URL
or two it would be a help.

--
Greg Louis
Biopsy 2004-06-22 (age 58), Gleason 3+3, T1c, volume 27 cc. Monotherapy,
55 I-125 seeds 2004-11-16. Lowest PSA yet 0.59 (8 mo); then 0.62, 0.85,
0.75, 1.7, 3.29, 1.29 (whew!) 28.5 mo, 1.41, 0.78, 0.91 at 3 yr.

Greg Louis wrote:
> On Mon, 05 May 2008 14:40:54 -0700, I.P. Freely wrote:
>
>> Felmer Dingle wrote:
>>> I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
>>> do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any
>>> suggestions for short term memory excersizes or techniques?
>> Not on a statin, are you?
>>
>> I.P.
>
> I.P., could you cite chapter & verse on that? I am on a statin and have
> some trouble with short-term memory; same for my wife. We thought it was
> just due to getting older... I'll try google but if you can suggest a URL
> or two it would be a help.

I can do better that: Google statin memory loss for hundreds of RELEVANT
items on it from a huge variety of credible sources. One of the top
hits is Spacedoc (Astronaut physician Duane Graveline), who has a
website and a book out on it summarizing his research into the
unintended effects of statins. I have and recommend the book, and if he
is half the man and mind my astronaut physician friend is, he is credible.

I.P.

On Tue, 06 May 2008 09:48:41 -0700, I.P. Freely wrote:

> Greg Louis wrote:
>> I.P., could you cite chapter & verse on that? I am on a statin and
>> have some trouble with short-term memory; same for my wife. We thought
>> it was just due to getting older... I'll try google but if you can
>> suggest a URL or two it would be a help.
>
> I can do better that: Google statin memory loss for hundreds of RELEVANT
> items on it from a huge variety of credible sources.

I searched google.scholar for "statin memory" and got a sufficiency
(dunno if it would have been hundreds, I didn't count) of relevant
items. Unfortunately several of the most promising titles were in a
journal called pharmacotherapy that requires payment for access, but even
the quotations in the google entries were enough that I shall be making a
case for discontinuing atorvastatin (and upping the coenzyme Q10 intake)
when I see my physician later this month. Anecdotal info: my wife and I
both have some memory loss; both started to notice such loss about a year
into taking atorvastatin for lipoprotein regulation; her memory is worse
than mine; she's on 20mg per day, I'm on 10. Both of us take 200mg per
day of coQ10 to help with what we (and my MD) think is atorvastatin-
related back pain. Both of us have pretty decent HDL and LDL figures
now, probably thanks to the drug. Maybe we can keep it that way if we
eat a bit more carefully.

> One of the top
> hits is Spacedoc (Astronaut physician Duane Graveline), who has a
> website and a book out on it summarizing his research into the
> unintended effects of statins. I have and recommend the book, and if he
> is half the man and mind my astronaut physician friend is, he is
> credible.

Doubtless it's my background that prejudices me (I was a research
scientist for part of my career) but for scientific info, peer review and
publication in a respected journal are my criteria for credible. That's
not to denigrate the Graveline book, which I haven't seen; I'll look for
reviews and look into his published papers. Thanks for the tip!

--
Greg Louis
Biopsy 2004-06-22 (age 58), Gleason 3+3, T1c, volume 27 cc. Monotherapy,
55 I-125 seeds 2004-11-16. Lowest PSA yet 0.59 (8 mo); then 0.62, 0.85,
0.75, 1.7, 3.29, 1.29 (whew!) 28.5 mo, 1.41, 0.78, 0.91 at 3 yr.

Greg Louis wrote:

> I searched google.scholar for "statin memory" and got a sufficiency
> (dunno if it would have been hundreds, I didn't count) of relevant
> items.

Drop the quotes and add the word loss and the relevant hits expand
dramatically. Even the 20th page (200 hits and counting) was still very
relevant.

> Both of us have pretty decent HDL and LDL figures
> now, probably thanks to the drug. Maybe we can keep it that way if we
> eat a bit more carefully.

My chol profile is genetically poor (borderline total chol, elevated
LDL, very low HDL). My very healthy diet and tons of exercise do little
for it, but even a low dose of statins improved them very dramatically,
driving everything well into the desirable ranges. Then after 6-8 years
of this, the muscle pain hit. It took a year to dissipate after I
dropped the statin. Now fish oil does almost as much good as the statin
did, sans pain.

> Doubtless it's my background that prejudices me (I was a research
> scientist for part of my career) but for scientific info, peer review and
> publication in a respected journal are my criteria for credible. That's
> not to denigrate the Graveline book, which I haven't seen; I'll look for
> reviews and look into his published papers. Thanks for the tip!

Graveline doesn't write the papers; he studies them and reports their
results, as do the more credible people here. I'm also a scientist and
engineer, and although peer-reviewed research is fine, I do like having
someone else do the legwork of finding it, assimilating it, organizing
it, presenting it in an organized manner, and supporting it with huge
bibliographies I can research selectively to verify that the authors are
not cherry picking their sources. Then if I suspect the author has
biased the story, or if its subject is as vital to me as the ADT choice
was, I'll go straight to the research in depth. The ever-increasing
reports of statin SEs plus my own head-to-toe pain left me little
patience for details; I wanted that crap out of my body. I can always go
back on another statin if fish oil fails me.

Graveline's book isn't quite the scientific study as, say, the global
warming books I've studied, and he does include too much anecdotal tales
to warm my heart. Is he biased? You bet; statins completely erased many
years of his memory, reversibly and repeatably, but I believe he's
sincere and informed about his aversion to statin and its hype. Statins
are great drugs for many, maybe most, people, but a very large minority
-- and a huge majority of very athletic people -- suffer appreciable,
some very dramatic, mental and/or physical SEs.

Besides, Google spit out memory loss reports from from many of the
world's leading hospitals and agencies.

I.P.

On May 5, 3:08 pm, Felmer Dingle <Fel...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
> do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any suggestions
> for short term memory excersizes or techniques?
>
> Felmer Dingle aka WhiteSoxFan

My experience with memory loss has been due to no testosterone. I have
struggled with this for over 7 years due to ADT treatments. Here is
what has worked for me.

1- supplement estrogen with estradiol patches
2- maintain constant good protein intake and keep carbs low
3- take a lot of DHA fraction of fish oil daily
4- maintain as much exercise I can (not very successful here)
And I take Ritalin daily

My short term memory has improved with the above but it ain't what it
used to be.

It took me many years to find a solution for me, it is best to keep
trying everything to see what works for you.
Lud

On 2008-05-08 11:39:49 -0500, Lud <LudwickP@gmail.com> said:

> On May 5, 3:08 pm, Felmer Dingle <Fel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I couldn't remember to do something 5 minutes after my wife asked me to
>> do it. Completely disappeared from my brains to do list. Any suggestions
>> for short term memory excersizes or techniques?
>>
>> Felmer Dingle aka WhiteSoxFan
>
> My experience with memory loss has been due to no testosterone. I have
> struggled with this for over 7 years due to ADT treatments. Here is
> what has worked for me.
>
> 1- supplement estrogen with estradiol patches
> 2- maintain constant good protein intake and keep carbs low
> 3- take a lot of DHA fraction of fish oil daily
> 4- maintain as much exercise I can (not very successful here)
> And I take Ritalin daily
>
> My short term memory has improved with the above but it ain't what it
> used to be.
>
> It took me many years to find a solution for me, it is best to keep
> trying everything to see what works for you.
> Lud


Permit me to add one more thing to your list, pay attention to that
which you are supposed to remember. Do not try to multi-task, pay
specific attention to what it is that you are supposed to remember. Do
not listen to the wife/boss/whoever with one ear, look at them and
really listen. It does help, if you can remember to do it.

Bob C wrote:
>
> Permit me to add one more thing to your list, pay attention to that
> which you are supposed to remember. Do not try to multi-task, pay
> specific attention to what it is that you are supposed to remember. Do
> not listen to the wife/boss/whoever with one ear, look at them and
> really listen. It does help, if you can remember to do it.

Excellent advice, for three reasons:

1. The human brain can't really multitask. It just shifts focus rapidly
when we're young, SIMULATING multitasking. Because the attention shift
takes a non-zero time, it is less efficient than doing each of those
tasks independently.

2. Even that ability declines with age.

3. And, of course, many drugs and their SEs can further mess with our
heads. Statins and testosterone-lowering drugs are both suspected of
being strong contributors.

I.P.

"Bob C" <bob@bob.org> wrote in message
news:2008051310431875249-bob@boborg...

> Permit me to add one more thing to your list, pay attention to that which
> you are supposed to remember. Do not try to multi-task, pay specific
> attention to what it is that you are supposed to remember. Do not listen
> to the wife/boss/whoever with one ear, look at them and really listen.
> It does help, if you can remember to do it.

Well stated. I find that I'm pissing people off more and more by stopping
what I'm doing, putting my hands in my lap, and turning to the person who
just interrupted me. My wife is especially sensitive to this maneuver. She
always thinks I'm being an asshole. Well, maybe sometimes I am.

On May 13, 7:24 pm, "Steve Kramer" <skra...@cinci.rr.com> wrote:
> "Bob C" <b...@bob.org> wrote in message
>
> news:2008051310431875249-bob@boborg...
>
> > Permit me to add one more thing to your list, pay attention to that which
> > you are supposed to remember. Do not try to multi-task, pay specific
> > attention to what it is that you are supposed to remember. Do not listen
> > to the wife/boss/whoever with one ear, look at them and really listen.
> > It does help, if you can remember to do it.
>
> Well stated. I find that I'm pissing people off more and more by stopping
> what I'm doing, putting my hands in my lap, and turning to the person who
> just interrupted me. My wife is especially sensitive to this maneuver. She
> always thinks I'm being an asshole. Well, maybe sometimes I am.

"Pay attention" - easier said than done - I can't even do that most
times.

It ain't aging - it's losing estrogen - when I was on high doses of
estradiol patches (6 x 100 mcg), I had no problems with memory or
multi-tasking, even could out-argue my wife (only time in my life).

Men - estrogen is the magic elixir.
Lud

> Bob C wrote:

>
> 3. And, of course, many drugs and their SEs can further mess with our
> heads.

Ahhh yes, the many drugs of the 70s. Me thinks the real reason for my
Short Term Memory
;0)

WhiteSoxFan