NEED HELP ADVICE FAST LIVER FAILING

Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
for a high CEA of 215.
The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
& 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
scan

It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
much help here. I don't know how log my liver will continue to function
at these levels and if the swelling gets any bigger it will block it off
entirely.

Onc thinks the answer is to change the irinitican to a lower dose every
week and add erbitux. He thinks that will shrink the swelling That
sounds like BS to me. Common sense dictates if your liver has a partial
blocking of the waste exit and you have cirrosis issues then pouring
more toxins in doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had a hard time
tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
should I call the priest?


Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this
*
Findings:* There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
burden.* Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
pancreas.* There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
metastic disease.
*
The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
the left hepatic lobe.* I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
the liver, however.
*
There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously.* This
may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
well.* There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
without diverticulitis.
*
***Impression:
*
1.* Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.
*
2.* The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
from the liver as there is now periportal edema.
*
3.* Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
metastatic disease.
*

On Mar 24, 9:38 pm, jonbo...@webtv.net (J W) wrote:
> Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
> posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
> doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
> for a high CEA of 215.
> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
> from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
> nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
> bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
> been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
> Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
> & 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
> liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
> not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
> that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
> some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
> scan
>
> It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
> drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
> he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
> else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
> much help here. I don't know how log my liver will continue to function
> at these levels and if the swelling gets any bigger it will block it off
> entirely.
>
> Onc thinks the answer is to change the irinitican to a lower dose every
> week and add erbitux. He thinks that will shrink the swelling That
> sounds like BS to me. Common sense dictates if your liver has a partial
> blocking of the waste exit and you have cirrosis issues then pouring
> more toxins in doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had a hard time
> tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
> working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
> months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
> stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
> with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
> should I call the priest?
>
> Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this
>
> Findings: There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
> burden. Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
> the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
> pancreas. There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
> chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
> metastic disease.
>
> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
> lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
> the left hepatic lobe. I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
> the liver, however.
>
> There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
> in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously. This
> may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
> well. There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
> without diverticulitis.
>
> ***Impression:
>
> 1. Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
> pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
> to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.
>
> 2. The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
> from the liver as there is now periportal edema.
>
> 3. Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
> not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
> metastatic disease.
>

JW

I am sorry to read your post, looks like you are in a dangerous place
right now. I can't offer advice.
I just wanted you to know that your in my thoughts and prayers - I
pray that the medics can come up with some way to clear this blockage
for you, try to think positive, you are not a gonna yet.

(((( Stay strong )))) hugs

isi

J W wrote:

> Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
> posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
> doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
> for a high CEA of 215.
> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
> from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
> nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
> bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
> been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
> Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
> & 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
> liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
> not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
> that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
> some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
> scan
>
> It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
> drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
> he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
> else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
> much help here.

Thdere's a surgeon on newsgroup named sci.med named Howard M
Ask him if he concurs with surgical opinion.
J

sci.med what??? I have limited accss to newsgroups with webtv. I put in
just sci.med and a lot of groups come up.


Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sat, Mar 24, 2007, 4:29pm (EDT-1) From:
nexsw@nvalid (J) wrote:

Thdere's a surgeon on newsgroup named sci.med named Howard M Ask him if
he concurs with surgical opinion. J

J W wrote:

> sci.med what??? I have limited accss to newsgroups with webtv. I put in
> just sci.med and a lot of groups come up.
>
>
> Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sat, Mar 24, 2007, 4:29pm (EDT-1) From:
> nexsw@nvalid (J) wrote:
>
> Thdere's a surgeon on newsgroup named sci.med named Howard M Ask him if
> he concurs with surgical opinion. J

Just sci.med
It's a general medicine newsgroup
J

News: sci.med.diseases.cancer
Maybe?

--
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the
intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in
one hand, Starbucks in the other, totally worn out and
screaming,
"WOO HOO what a ride!"


"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:7478-46059E22-95@storefull-3258.bay.webtv.net...
> sci.med what??? I have limited accss to newsgroups with webtv. I put in
> just sci.med and a lot of groups come up.
>
>
> Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sat, Mar 24, 2007, 4:29pm (EDT-1) From:
> nexsw@nvalid (J) wrote:
>
> Thdere's a surgeon on newsgroup named sci.med named Howard M Ask him if
> he concurs with surgical opinion. J
>
>
>
>

Nope. Just News: sci.med

--
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the
intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in
one hand, Starbucks in the other, totally worn out and
screaming,
"WOO HOO what a ride!"


"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:2576-46057E2B-600@storefull-3252.bay.webtv.net...
Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
for a high CEA of 215.
The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
& 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
scan

It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
much help here. I don't know how log my liver will continue to function
at these levels and if the swelling gets any bigger it will block it off
entirely.

Onc thinks the answer is to change the irinitican to a lower dose every
week and add erbitux. He thinks that will shrink the swelling That
sounds like BS to me. Common sense dictates if your liver has a partial
blocking of the waste exit and you have cirrosis issues then pouring
more toxins in doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had a hard time
tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
should I call the priest?


Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this

Findings: There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
burden. Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
pancreas. There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
metastic disease.

The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
the left hepatic lobe. I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
the liver, however.

There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously. This
may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
well. There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
without diverticulitis.

***Impression:

1. Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.

2. The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
from the liver as there is now periportal edema.

3. Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
metastatic disease.

J W wrote:

> sci.med what??? I have limited accss to newsgroups with webtv. I put in
> just sci.med and a lot of groups come up.
>
>
> Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sat, Mar 24, 2007, 4:29pm (EDT-1) From:
> nexsw@nvalid (J) wrote:
>
> Thdere's a surgeon on newsgroup named sci.med named Howard M Ask him if
> he concurs with surgical opinion. J

Well, I see your post there, but it's blank.
He does not answer every post.
Only posts that appear to be surgical and/or that he wishes to enter into
the discussion.
So you'd better post the full post there, just as you did here, and finish
it, with "I am asking for surgical opinion from Howard please."
Be polite or he stops replying.
I don't know if he's there weekends so you have to wait it out and see if he
replies.
J

I found one just sci.med, not sure if that is the one you are talking
about. It had 900+ posts and I posted a ping for Howard M. Could you
check the one you are talking about and see if my ping is there. If not
can you post a copy of my post in the group you are talking about and
either ask him to come to this group or provide me a link to that
group???

Copy and paste for Webtv users
Take the cursor and put it at the beginning of what you want to copy. Drag
across pushing the left side of the mouse. This puts a blue fog across the
letters.
At the end do the following.


ctrl and the c key copies everything you highlighted

ctrl and the v key pastes it onto a new page

ctrl and the x key removes what ever off the page.




--
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the
intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in
one hand, Starbucks in the other, totally worn out and
screaming,
"WOO HOO what a ride!"


"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:2576-46057E2B-600@storefull-3252.bay.webtv.net...
Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
for a high CEA of 215.
The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
& 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
scan

It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
much help here. I don't know how log my liver will continue to function
at these levels and if the swelling gets any bigger it will block it off
entirely.

Onc thinks the answer is to change the irinitican to a lower dose every
week and add erbitux. He thinks that will shrink the swelling That
sounds like BS to me. Common sense dictates if your liver has a partial
blocking of the waste exit and you have cirrosis issues then pouring
more toxins in doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had a hard time
tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
should I call the priest?


Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this

Findings: There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
burden. Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
pancreas. There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
metastic disease.

The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
the left hepatic lobe. I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
the liver, however.

There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously. This
may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
well. There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
without diverticulitis.

***Impression:

1. Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.

2. The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
from the liver as there is now periportal edema.

3. Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
metastatic disease.

JW should read Cursor not Mouse. I was teaching my sister to c/p and she has
webtv.

--
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the
intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in
one hand, Starbucks in the other, totally worn out and
screaming,
"WOO HOO what a ride!"


"betsyb" <betsy958@TRASHoptonline.net> wrote in message
news:eu4anq01jb@news4.newsguy.com...
> Copy and paste for Webtv users
> Take the cursor and put it at the beginning of what you want to copy. Drag
> across pushing the left side of the mouse. This puts a blue fog across the
> letters.
> At the end do the following.
>
>
> ctrl and the c key copies everything you highlighted
>
> ctrl and the v key pastes it onto a new page
>
> ctrl and the x key removes what ever off the page.
>
>
>
>
> --
> "Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the
> intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well
> preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in
> one hand, Starbucks in the other, totally worn out and
> screaming,
> "WOO HOO what a ride!"
>
>
> "J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
> news:2576-46057E2B-600@storefull-3252.bay.webtv.net...
> Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
> posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
> doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
> for a high CEA of 215.
> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
> from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
> nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
> bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
> been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
> Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
> & 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
> liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
> not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
> that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
> some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
> scan
>
> It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
> drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
> he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
> else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
> much help here. I don't know how log my liver will continue to function
> at these levels and if the swelling gets any bigger it will block it off
> entirely.
>
> Onc thinks the answer is to change the irinitican to a lower dose every
> week and add erbitux. He thinks that will shrink the swelling That
> sounds like BS to me. Common sense dictates if your liver has a partial
> blocking of the waste exit and you have cirrosis issues then pouring
> more toxins in doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had a hard time
> tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
> working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
> months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
> stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
> with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
> should I call the priest?
>
>
> Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this
>
> Findings: There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
> burden. Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
> the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
> pancreas. There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
> chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
> metastic disease.
>
> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
> lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
> the left hepatic lobe. I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
> the liver, however.
>
> There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
> in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously. This
> may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
> well. There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
> without diverticulitis.
>
> ***Impression:
>
> 1. Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
> pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
> to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.
>
> 2. The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
> from the liver as there is now periportal edema.
>
> 3. Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
> not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
> metastatic disease.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

I think you misnderstood me. I know how to cut and paste with webtv as
evidenced by my posting copies of the previous poster's comments that I
am responding to. What was asking J was to see if the sci.med group I
found was indeed the one he was talking about by seeing if my ping to
Howard M was there. If the ping was ot there then the group I found
would not b the one J was talking about, which would mean it would most
likely be one that would not come up for my webtv when doing a sci.med
search. If that were the case I was asking him to cut and paste my post
to that group and ask mr. Howard to either come to this group or perhaps
J could provide me a link to the group.


Re: NEED HELP ADVICE FAST LIVER FAILING

Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sat, Mar 24, 2007, 7:03pm From:
betsy958@TRASHoptonline.net (betsyb)
Copy and paste for Webtv users
Take the cursor and put it at the beginning of what you want to copy.
Drag across pushing the left side of the mouse. This puts a blue fog
across the letters.
At the end do the following.
ctrl and the c key copies everything you highlighted
ctrl and the v key pastes it onto a new page
ctrl and the x key removes what ever off the page.

I copied your posting here and pasted on sci med. If he sees and responds I
will get it to you and explain your situation so maybe he will visit here
and you can get help.

--
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the
intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in
one hand, Starbucks in the other, totally worn out and
screaming,
"WOO HOO what a ride!"


"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:16256-4605BD27-559@storefull-3253.bay.webtv.net...
>I think you misnderstood me. I know how to cut and paste with webtv as
> evidenced by my posting copies of the previous poster's comments that I
> am responding to. What was asking J was to see if the sci.med group I
> found was indeed the one he was talking about by seeing if my ping to
> Howard M was there. If the ping was ot there then the group I found
> would not b the one J was talking about, which would mean it would most
> likely be one that would not come up for my webtv when doing a sci.med
> search. If that were the case I was asking him to cut and paste my post
> to that group and ask mr. Howard to either come to this group or perhaps
> J could provide me a link to the group.
>
>
> Re: NEED HELP ADVICE FAST LIVER FAILING
>
> Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sat, Mar 24, 2007, 7:03pm From:
> betsy958@TRASHoptonline.net (betsyb)
> Copy and paste for Webtv users
> Take the cursor and put it at the beginning of what you want to copy.
> Drag across pushing the left side of the mouse. This puts a blue fog
> across the letters.
> At the end do the following.
> ctrl and the c key copies everything you highlighted
> ctrl and the v key pastes it onto a new page
> ctrl and the x key removes what ever off the page.
>
>
>
>

"Howard McCollister" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:4605c81d$0$92375$bb4e3ad8@newscene.com...
>
> "betsyb" <betsy958@TRASHoptonline.net> wrote in message
> news:eu4efi04ie@news4.newsguy.com...
>> Can you help this fella? He is visually impaired so I am posting his plea
>> for help here. Any words of wisdom will be appreciated.
>> BetsyB
>>
>>
>> "J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
>> news:<2576-46057E2B-600@storefull-3252.bay.webtv.net>...
>> Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
>> posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
>> doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
>> for a high CEA of 215.
>> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
>> from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
>> nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
>> bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
>> been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
>> Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
>> & 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
>> liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
>> not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
>> that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
>> some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
>> scan
>>
>> It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
>> drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
>> he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
>> else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
>> much help here. I don't know how log my liver will continue to function
>> at these levels and if the swelling gets any bigger it will block it off
>> entirely.
>>
>> Onc thinks the answer is to change the irinitican to a lower dose every
>> week and add erbitux. He thinks that will shrink the swelling That
>> sounds like BS to me. Common sense dictates if your liver has a partial
>> blocking of the waste exit and you have cirrosis issues then pouring
>> more toxins in doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had a hard time
>> tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
>> working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
>> months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
>> stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
>> with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
>> should I call the priest?
>>
>>
>> Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this
>>
>> Findings: There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
>> burden. Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
>> the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
>> pancreas. There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
>> chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
>> metastic disease.
>>
>> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
>> lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
>> the left hepatic lobe. I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
>> the liver, however.
>>
>> There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
>> in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously. This
>> may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
>> well. There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
>> without diverticulitis.
>>
>> ***Impression:
>>
>> 1. Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
>> pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
>> to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.
>>
>> 2. The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
>> from the liver as there is now periportal edema.
>>
>> 3. Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
>> not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
>> metastatic disease.
>
>
> I'm a little handicapped by not knowing what the original cancer was, but,
> regardless it appears to have extended quite rapidly. Of the various organ
> systems affected by the metastatic process, it's the blockage of the
> common
> bile duct and probably portal vein that are causing you the most
> symptoms -
> they reside in the porta hepatis and the tumor appears to be choking them
> off..
>
> Surgery to improve drainage there is really a bad idea. The porta hepatis
> is
> a tricky place to work under the best of circumstances and in this
> situation
> the risks far outweigh the benefits. Even if such an operation were
> possible
> and doing it extended your life, it's unlikely that it would extend it
> much
> beyond the recovery from the operation. In this situation, the only thing
> that might be considered would be using CT or ultrasound to guide one or
> more catheters through the skin and into the liver bile ducts. Without
> imaging or knowing you, there's no way I could guess whether or not it's
> feasible - it's something you should ask your doctors about
> though...percutaneous transhepatic bile duct cannulation. By decreasing
> the
> jaundice, some of your symptoms may ameliorate. It may not be possible if
> your coagulation is affected, or if your venous pressures are too high
> from
> compression of the portal vein.
>
> Whatever it is you have, I'm sure you're aware that it's past the point of
> reversal and is rapidly advancing as the tumor burden exponentially
> increases. I'm sure it's the goal of your doctors to keep you as
> comfortable
> as possible over these next few weeks, and I hope they can accomplish
> that.
>
> HMc
>

Howard I am posting this to alt.support.cancer. John cannot get this group
on webtv.
Thank you for responding so quickly.
BetsyB

--
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the
intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in
one hand, Starbucks in the other, totally worn out and
screaming,
"WOO HOO what a ride!"


"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:2576-46057E2B-600@storefull-3252.bay.webtv.net...
Well folks it appears that I'm a goner according to my latest CT scan
posted below and my oncologist. 6 weeks ago Prior to getting these two
doses of irinitican or CPT-11 at the strongest dose I was fine except
for a high CEA of 215.
The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis is blocking my lymph nodes
from draining if I'm reading it right so now I've got swollen lymph
nodes all over the place. 3 weeks ago my blood tests showed normal
bilirubin, ALT & AST, only alkaline phophotase was high at 300 but hat's
been running high for over 6 months and had actually come down from 400.
Now the CEA is 331, bilirubin is 2.2, ALT & AST are off the chart at 551
& 422. I'm completely jaundice,itchy all over, pee is ice tea color,
liver, stomach and back are giving me lots of pain. Taking diluadid but
not helping much. Onc was nice enough to tell my primary doc but not me
that my time was short, how short he didn't say. Dec. 06 PET scan showed
some retrocrural lymph nodes lightig up but they appeared normal on CT
scan

It seems the immediate problem is this liquid edema blocking the liver
drainage. I asked why we couldn't go in and drain that or remove it and
he said no surgeon would touch me with liver numbers that high but how
else can we get rid of that blockage without going in? I'm not getting
much help here. I don't know how log my liver will continue to function
at these levels and if the swelling gets any bigger it will block it off
entirely.

Onc thinks the answer is to change the irinitican to a lower dose every
week and add erbitux. He thinks that will shrink the swelling That
sounds like BS to me. Common sense dictates if your liver has a partial
blocking of the waste exit and you have cirrosis issues then pouring
more toxins in doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I've had a hard time
tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
should I call the priest?


Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this

Findings: There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
burden. Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
pancreas. There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
metastic disease.

The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
the left hepatic lobe. I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
the liver, however.

There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously. This
may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
well. There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
without diverticulitis.

***Impression:

1. Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.

2. The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
from the liver as there is now periportal edema.

3. Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
metastatic disease.

J W schreef:
> Any ideas? What can be done to deal
> with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
> should I call the priest?
>
I can't help you with your questions but do wish and hope something can
be done about this blockage. If you were previously doing rather well
considering te circumstances it's very hard to accept and believe that
things take a turn for the worst so soon and there seems to be almost no
time left. If I understand correctly, if the blockage is resolved, the
liver can start working again and though there are mets you could have
some good time? I do hope something can be done.
Thinking of you,

Anne

betsyb wrote:

> "Howard McCollister" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
> .
> >> "J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
> >
> I've had a hard time
> >> tolerating this CPT-11 and judging from the disease progression it isn't
> >> working in fact it seems like the cancer likes the stuff. I've been 15
> >> months since surgery with no visible tumors, now after two doses of this
> >> stuff they are popping out all over. Any ideas? What can be done to deal
> >> with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
> >> should I call the priest?
> >>
> >>
> >> Prior CT examination 12/14/06 showed none of this
> >>
> >> Findings: There is marked interval worsening in the patient's disease
> >> burden. Most notably, there is now bulky adenopathy at the root of
> >> the mesentery extending up into the porta hepatis and posterior to the
> >> pancreas. There is also some adenopathy extending down the aortic
> >> chain and into the right retrocrural area. This is all concerning for
> >> metastic disease.
> >>
> >> The bulky adenopathy in the porta hepatis appears to be compromising the
> >> lymphatic drainage as there is now periportal edema, predominantly in
> >> the left hepatic lobe. I do not see evidence of actual metastasis to
> >> the liver, however.
> >>
> >> There also are at least two, punctate, subcentimeter nodules idenified
> >> in the right lung base that were not clearly present previously. This
> >> may represent very early metastatic desease to the right lung base as
> >> well. There is stable diverticular desease to the sigmoid colon,
> >> without diverticulitis.
> >>
> >> ***Impression:
> >>
> >> 1. Marked interval worsening in the appearance of the abdomen and
> >> pelvis with extensive adenopathy at the root of the mesentery, extending
> >> to the retroperitoneum and up into the porta hepatis.
> >>
> >> 2. The adenopathy appears to be compromising the lymphatic drainage
> >> from the liver as there is now periportal edema.
> >>
> >> 3. Punctate, subcentimeter nodules in the right lung base. These were
> >> not present previously and are also concerning for possible early
> >> metastatic disease.
> >
> Howard McCollister" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
> > I'm a little handicapped by not knowing what the original cancer was, but,
> > regardless it appears to have extended quite rapidly. Of the various organ
> > systems affected by the metastatic process, it's the blockage of the
> > common
> > bile duct and probably portal vein that are causing you the most
> > symptoms -
> > they reside in the porta hepatis and the tumor appears to be choking them
> > off..
> >
> > Surgery to improve drainage there is really a bad idea. The porta hepatis
> > is
> > a tricky place to work under the best of circumstances and in this
> > situation
> > the risks far outweigh the benefits. Even if such an operation were
> > possible
> > and doing it extended your life, it's unlikely that it would extend it
> > much
> > beyond the recovery from the operation. In this situation, the only thing
> > that might be considered would be using CT or ultrasound to guide one or
> > more catheters through the skin and into the liver bile ducts. Without
> > imaging or knowing you, there's no way I could guess whether or not it's
> > feasible - it's something you should ask your doctors about
> > though...percutaneous transhepatic bile duct cannulation. By decreasing
> > the
> > jaundice, some of your symptoms may ameliorate. It may not be possible if
> > your coagulation is affected, or if your venous pressures are too high
> > from
> > compression of the portal vein.
> >
> > Whatever it is you have, I'm sure you're aware that it's past the point of
> > reversal and is rapidly advancing as the tumor burden exponentially
> > increases. I'm sure it's the goal of your doctors to keep you as
> > comfortable
> > as possible over these next few weeks, and I hope they can accomplish
> > that.
> >
> > HMc
> >
>
> Howard I am posting this to alt.support.cancer.

I think that's the only reply he'll get from Howard.
Signet cell colon cancer is much more aggressive than the type Joe has.
Last May, Steph told "JW" (Jon) that it would be back.
Chemo's done all it can do unless he wants to go into a clinical trial for those
who have less than 3 or 6 months. He'd have to talk with his oncologist whether
he meets any criteria for such, at this point.
The only question now is whether RT can safely palliate his pain in the
liver/pancreatic area.
And whether he'll be able to do some travelling.

I'm sorry, Jon
J
Note for me (from one of his posts): diagnosed 12/22/05 w/ stage 4 colon cancer
w/ mets to peritoneum & omentum

J wrote:

> Signet cell colon cancer is much more aggressive than the type Joe has.

Any adenocarcinoma can be mucinous (signet ring) - is my understanding.
J

Quote from http://www.cancerhelp.org.uk/help/default.asp?page=4020
Types of bowel cancer
Mucinous tumours often have the cancer cells in pools of mucus. Signet-ring tumours
have mucus inside the cells. The mucus pushes the nucleus (control centre) of the
cell over to one side, making the tumour cell look the shape of a signet ring under
the microscope. Only about 1-2% of all colorectal cancers are signet-ring type.

"starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4605eb0b$0$711$5fc3050@dreader2.news.tiscali. nl...
>J W schreef:
>> Any ideas? What can be done to deal
>> with this blockage so the liver can drain properly? Is there anything or
>> should I call the priest?
>>
> I can't help you with your questions but do wish and hope something can be
> done about this blockage. If you were previously doing rather well
> considering te circumstances it's very hard to accept and believe that
> things take a turn for the worst so soon and there seems to be almost no
> time left. If I understand correctly, if the blockage is resolved, the
> liver can start working again and though there are mets you could have
> some good time? I do hope something can be done.
> Thinking of you,
>
> Anne


Positive thoughts and prayers are with you. Stay strong. Our bodies are
stronger than we think they are, even with cancer.

Good vibes sent to you!
Giuditta

Getting into clinical trials has been a thorn n my side since dy one.
First they said I needed to have measureable tumor which up until now I
didn't have, then they said I have to have failed two lines of standard
chemo which now I have. So now I shold be able to get into a clinical
trial right??? NOT they won't touch me with liver and bilirubin numbers
that high and without a stent or shunt to open the hepatic portal or
some miracle drug to shrnk the lymph nodes there is no way to get those
liver numbers down so as far as clinical trials go Ihave been screwed
from day one on getting into any. My primry doctor is going tosee if a
gastro doc can put in a stent or shunt via endoscopic means but she
doesn't think he will. A friend from ACOR suggested getting an
interventional radiologist to put in a stent or shunt via the jugular
vein. I don't know what todo. I've heard there are massage techniques to
get lymph nodes to drain, not sure if that would work. I've seen
tinctures advertised thatcllaim to help lymphatic system to drain. I
gotta do something
this article I found says the mean survival time for this type problem
if I don't get a sten/sunt is 0.6 month or about 2 1/12 weeks
https://profreg.medscape.com/px/getl...UvNDcyNjA5XzM=
If the link doesn't work you can find it on google with this phrase
Jaundice Secondary to Isolated Porta Hepatis Metastasis


Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sun, Mar 25, 2007, 3:23am (EDT-1) From:
nexsw@nvalid (J) wrote:

I think that's the only reply he'll get from Howard. Signet cell colon
cancer is much more aggressive than the type Joe has. Last May, Steph
told "JW" (Jon) that it would be back. Chemo's done all it can do unless
he wants to go into a clinical trial for those who have less than 3 or 6
months. He'd have to talk with his oncologist whether he meets any
criteria for such, at this point. The only question now is whether RT
can safely palliate his pain in the liver/pancreatic area.
And whether he'll be able to do some travelling.
I'm sorry, Jon
J

J W wrote:

> Getting into clinical trials has been a thorn n my side since dy one.
> First they said I needed to have measureable tumor which up until now I
> didn't have, then they said I have to have failed two lines of standard
> chemo which now I have. So now I shold be able to get into a clinical
> trial right??? NOT they won't touch me with liver and bilirubin numbers
> that high and without a stent or shunt to open the hepatic portal or
> some miracle drug to shrnk the lymph nodes there is no way to get those
> liver numbers down so as far as clinical trials go Ihave been screwed
> from day one on getting into any. My primry doctor is going tosee if a
> gastro doc can put in a stent or shunt via endoscopic means but she
> doesn't think he will. A friend from ACOR suggested getting an
> interventional radiologist to put in a stent or shunt via the jugular
> vein. I don't know what todo. I've heard there are massage techniques to
> get lymph nodes to drain, not sure if that would work. I've seen
> tinctures advertised thatcllaim to help lymphatic system to drain. I
> gotta do something
> this article I found says the mean survival time for this type problem
> if I don't get a sten/sunt is 0.6 month or about 2 1/12 weeks

I hear you, Jon.
I was looking at the situation here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porta_hepatis
I suppose anything's doable, if you find someone brave enough and willing to try it.
I wonder what they'll find (once) in there and/or if they get you past this crisis, the mets in lungs and liver and
pancreas will continue growing. From one crisis to another.
But it's your body.
J

J wrote:

> J W wrote:
>
> > Getting into clinical trials has been a thorn n my side since dy one.
> > First they said I needed to have measureable tumor which up until now I
> > didn't have, then they said I have to have failed two lines of standard
> > chemo which now I have. So now I shold be able to get into a clinical
> > trial right??? NOT they won't touch me with liver and bilirubin numbers
> > that high and without a stent or shunt to open the hepatic portal or
> > some miracle drug to shrnk the lymph nodes there is no way to get those
> > liver numbers down so as far as clinical trials go Ihave been screwed
> > from day one on getting into any. My primry doctor is going tosee if a
> > gastro doc can put in a stent or shunt via endoscopic means but she
> > doesn't think he will. A friend from ACOR suggested getting an
> > interventional radiologist to put in a stent or shunt via the jugular
> > vein. I don't know what todo. I've heard there are massage techniques to
> > get lymph nodes to drain, not sure if that would work. I've seen
> > tinctures advertised thatcllaim to help lymphatic system to drain. I
> > gotta do something
> > this article I found says the mean survival time for this type problem
> > if I don't get a sten/sunt is 0.6 month or about 2 1/12 weeks
>
> I hear you, Jon.
> I was looking at the situation here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porta_hepatis
> I suppose anything's doable, if you find someone brave enough and willing to try it.
> I wonder what they'll find (once) in there and/or if they get you past this crisis, the mets in lungs and liver and
> pancreas will continue growing. From one crisis to another.
> But it's your body.
> J

oh shoot! Sorry, you can't see the diagram there.
J

J schreef:
>
> I hear you, Jon.
> I was looking at the situation here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porta_hepatis
> I suppose anything's doable, if you find someone brave enough and willing to try it.
> I wonder what they'll find (once) in there and/or if they get you past this crisis, the mets in lungs and liver and
> pancreas will continue growing. From one crisis to another.
> But it's your body.
> J
>
>
The end is inevitable but the way Jon describes it, he could do fine for
some time when the blockage is resolved and the liver can do its job.
Maybe in two months there will be other big problems but that is two
months from now in which Jon could have a rather good life with quality
time, moments with loved ones, making memories.
So I in that case would do anything to get that liver working again,
even it means I would die in the procedure, because if the liver isn't
working it's only a matter of weeks at the most with extreme fatigue
etc. I personally certainly wouldn't opt for that trial though and yet
another chemo that probably only makes you sick again, I think it's a
waste of time. To me better spent otherwise if the blockage can be
resolved and one is in relatively good health for a while (however short
that might be).
But those few extra weeks quality time, maybe even months mean a lot
to some one who is dying of cancer, I personally would take the risk
that the operation fails and I would die during the procedure. That
would be my choice and I hope that when I would be in that situation
some day I'm able to convince the specialists to try to put that stent in.

Anne

First of all I am so sorry to hear about your new development, you will be
in my thoughts and prayers.

My primry doctor is going tosee if a
> gastro doc can put in a stent or shunt via endoscopic means but she
> doesn't think he will. A friend from ACOR suggested getting an
> interventional radiologist to put in a stent or shunt via the jugular
> vein. I don't know what todo.

Can you email the doc you saw in Baltimore? Sounded like he had some
connections who know how to perform the procedure.
Here is a site that sells the stents

http://www.medcompare.com/details/35104/SentinolAnd They would know who in
Florida has the expertise.....

http://www.jvir.org/cgi/content/full/15/9/999


Most the area teaching hospitals have an inverventional radiology
department....they are amazins similar to an operating room but the patients
usually go home the next day.

>
> Group: alt.support.cancer Date: Sun, Mar 25, 2007, 3:23am (EDT-1) From:
> nexsw@nvalid (J) wrote:
>
> I think that's the only reply he'll get from Howard. Signet cell colon
> cancer is much more aggressive than the type Joe has. Last May, Steph
> told "JW" (Jon) that it would be back.
That wasn't rock science, I am not impressed by "Steph". What would impress
me is to find a way to help JW.

Chemo's done all it can do unless
> he wants to go into a clinical trial for those who have less than 3 or 6
> months. He'd have to talk with his oncologist whether he meets any
> criteria for such, at this point.

The only question now is whether RT
> can safely palliate his pain in the liver/pancreatic area.

Once again pushing the old XRT you must get a bonus.

> And whether he'll be able to do some travelling.

Not necessarily true, if Jon elects hospice the hospice often has tricks up
their sleeves to improve the quality of life to the point of traveling
> I'm sorry, Jon
> J




>
>
>

"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:16256-4605BD27-559@storefull-3253.bay.webtv.net...
>I think you misnderstood me. I know how to cut and paste with webtv as
> evidenced by my posting copies of the previous poster's comments that I
> am responding to. What was asking J was to see if the sci.med group I
> found was indeed the one he was talking about by seeing if my ping to
> Howard M was there. If the ping was ot there then the group I found
> would not b the one J was talking about, which would mean it would most
> likely be one that would not come up for my webtv when doing a sci.med
> search. If that were the case I was asking him to cut and paste my post
> to that group and ask mr. Howard to either come to this group or perhaps
> J could provide me a link to the group.
>

Try this link
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med/topics

>
> Positive thoughts and prayers are with you. Stay strong. Our bodies are
> stronger than we think they are, even with cancer.
>
> Good vibes sent to you!
> Giuditta

Great answer...... I wish others in this group shared your thoughts....