The Silent Majority.

Now and again we hear mention of
"The Silent Majority" on this NG.
Here are some interesting statistics from Google:

alt.support cancer:
High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
total posts so far this month - 790.
Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.

That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.

Bill Thomas
CardiffUK.

"OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
> Now and again we hear mention of
> "The Silent Majority" on this NG.
> Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
>
> alt.support cancer:
> High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
> total posts so far this month - 790.
> Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.
>
> That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.
>

So? There is plenty of room for anyone who wants to write reasonable posts
in here. I doubt if you are one of them.

Pam S.

To the best of my knowledge there's nothing to stop anyone from posting, as
long as it's relevant and not offensive. All newsgroups have a core group
of posters, with others lurking to pick up info.

"OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
> Now and again we hear mention of
> "The Silent Majority" on this NG.
> Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
>
> alt.support cancer:
> High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
> total posts so far this month - 790.
> Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.
>
> That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.
>
> Bill Thomas
> CardiffUK.
>

I'd say OldBill wasn't trying to upset anyone. He was merely just showing
how people dealing with cancer possibly suffer in silence relating to user
activity in this newsgroup and those people possibly find it hard to open up
about their situation.

OldBill has posted some very supportive words to other users in the past so
you are mistaken Pam.

"tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:_qBlh.8866$X72.2961@newsread3.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
>

> So? There is plenty of room for anyone who wants to write reasonable
> posts in here. I doubt if you are one of them.
>
> Pam S.

"OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
> Now and again we hear mention of
> "The Silent Majority" on this NG.
> Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
>
> alt.support cancer:
> High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
> total posts so far this month - 790.
> Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.
>
> That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.
>
> Bill Thomas
> CardiffUK.
>
Would it not be logical that there were question askers and question
answerers, and that the answerers would post more than the askers?

Ian

Bozz wrote:
> "OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
> news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
> > Now and again we hear mention of
> > "The Silent Majority" on this NG.
> > Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
> >
> > alt.support cancer:
> > High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
> > total posts so far this month - 790.
> > Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.
> >
> > That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.
> >
> > Bill Thomas
> > CardiffUK.
> >
> Would it not be logical that there were question askers and question
> answerers, and that the answerers would post more than the askers?
>
> Ian

I'm one of those, "The Silent Majority"! I posted, asking for support and
information. I got a nasty response from one of the know-it-alls, somehow
they felt they knew me and put down my even asking the question but also me,
for my feelings.
Why do some people feel they have to put others down, not only for their
ignorance of a very complicated subject but also for being scared silly that
they may be losing their life or the life of a dear one?
((((OldBill)))) You hang in there and keep posting. Sometimes we want to
know statistics and if nothing else it takes our mind off our personal
grief/fear/worry.
Ellen

"OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
> Now and again we hear mention of
> "The Silent Majority" on this NG.
> Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
>
> alt.support cancer:
> High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
> total posts so far this month - 790.
> Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.
>
> That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.
>
> Bill Thomas
> CardiffUK.
>

Splenda wrote:
> I'm one of those, "The Silent Majority"! I posted, asking for support and
> information. I got a nasty response from one of the know-it-alls, somehow
> they felt they knew me and put down my even asking the question but also me,
> for my feelings.
> Why do some people feel they have to put others down, not only for their
> ignorance of a very complicated subject but also for being scared silly that
> they may be losing their life or the life of a dear one?
> ((((OldBill)))) You hang in there and keep posting. Sometimes we want to
> know statistics and if nothing else it takes our mind off our personal
> grief/fear/worry.
> Ellen
>
I agree with you Ellen, it is very different living with a cancer
diagnosis then viewing from the sidelines.

OldBill post to me highlighted the fact most of the posters are not
actively dealing with the disease. I don't think he was referencing
that there wasn't enough room for the others to post.

I do feel posters can be initimidating into not posting becoming the
silent majority.

Alex

"Alex" <usenetgirl@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1167589537.249458.323700@a3g2000cwd.googlegro ups.com...
>
> Splenda wrote:
>> I'm one of those, "The Silent Majority"! I posted, asking for support and
>> information. I got a nasty response from one of the know-it-alls, somehow
>> they felt they knew me and put down my even asking the question but also
>> me,
>> for my feelings.
>> Why do some people feel they have to put others down, not only for their
>> ignorance of a very complicated subject but also for being scared silly
>> that
>> they may be losing their life or the life of a dear one?
>> ((((OldBill)))) You hang in there and keep posting. Sometimes we want to
>> know statistics and if nothing else it takes our mind off our personal
>> grief/fear/worry.
>> Ellen
>>
> I agree with you Ellen, it is very different living with a cancer
> diagnosis then viewing from the sidelines.
>
> OldBill post to me highlighted the fact most of the posters are not
> actively dealing with the disease. I don't think he was referencing
> that there wasn't enough room for the others to post.
>
> I do feel posters can be initimidating into not posting becoming the
> silent majority.
>
> Alex
>

Maybe we need a graded response scale:
A. Give it to me straight doc.
B. Be gentle with me.
C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.

I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd me.
Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.

Ian

Viviane wrote:
> To the best of my knowledge there's nothing to stop anyone from posting, as
> long as it's relevant and not offensive. All newsgroups have a core group
> of posters, with others lurking to pick up info.
>
> "OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
> news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
>
>>Now and again we hear mention of
>>"The Silent Majority" on this NG.
>>Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
>>
>>alt.support cancer:
>>High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
>>total posts so far this month - 790.
>>Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.
>>
>>That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.
>>
>>Bill Thomas
>>CardiffUK.
>>
>
>
>
i'm a lurker - waitin for info relating to.......me?

"Raptor07" <raptor07@raptor07.com> wrote in message
news:459778a9$0$16556$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.a u...
> I'd say OldBill wasn't trying to upset anyone. He was merely just showing
> how people dealing with cancer possibly suffer in silence relating to user
> activity in this newsgroup and those people possibly find it hard to open
> up about their situation.
>
> OldBill has posted some very supportive words to other users in the past
> so you are mistaken Pam.
>

Sorry to post what I did. Bill's post hit me the wrong way at a time when I
shouldn't have been reading USENET. I get a little tired of some of the
idiots that come in here and attack the various good and informative authors
in here. Most posts are stupid enough that I can laugh about them, but
others just catch me on a bad day. You wouldn't believe the number of posts
I delete before posting them.

Pam S.

jim wrote:
> Viviane wrote:
> > To the best of my knowledge there's nothing to stop anyone from posting, as
> > long as it's relevant and not offensive.

Actually, it goes further than that. Anyone can post anything to an
unmoderated group, even if it's irrelevant and/or offensive. The most
that can be done to stop it is to inform the poster's provider, in
hopes that the post violates their policies.

> > All newsgroups have a core group
> > of posters, with others lurking to pick up info.
> >
> > "OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
> > news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
> >
> >>Now and again we hear mention of
> >>"The Silent Majority" on this NG.
> >>Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
> >>
> >>alt.support cancer:
> >>High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
> >>total posts so far this month - 790.
> >>Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.

2.5% of posters wrote 51% of posts. AFAIK, this is typical.

> >>
> >>That doesn't leave much for the remaining 383 subscribers.
> >>
> >>Bill Thomas
> >>CardiffUK.
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> i'm a lurker - waitin for info relating to.......me?

So post something about your condition, etc., and maybe you'll get
useful responses. No promises, though.

---
CSM

Alex wrote:
> Splenda wrote:
> > I'm one of those, "The Silent Majority"! I posted, asking for support and
> > information. I got a nasty response from one of the know-it-alls, somehow
> > they felt they knew me and put down my even asking the question but also me,
> > for my feelings.

This piqued my interest, as I'd got a bit of pointless unpleasantness
and pretentious bossiness from a regular. I looked around a bit,
though, and don't see where anyone was unpleasant to you, at least with
this handle. All I can say is do what you think is right, and don't
let the pushy types bother you. For every twit trying to ruin your
day, there are many who (often silently) support you.

> > Why do some people feel they have to put others down, not only for their
> > ignorance of a very complicated subject but also for being scared silly that
> > they may be losing their life or the life of a dear one?
> > ((((OldBill)))) You hang in there and keep posting. Sometimes we want to
> > know statistics and if nothing else it takes our mind off our personal
> > grief/fear/worry.
> > Ellen
> >
> I agree with you Ellen, it is very different living with a cancer
> diagnosis then viewing from the sidelines.
>
> OldBill post to me highlighted the fact most of the posters are not
> actively dealing with the disease. I don't think he was referencing
> that there wasn't enough room for the others to post.
>
> I do feel posters can be initimidating into not posting becoming the
> silent majority.

That's unfortunately true. This is an unmoderated group, and
therefore, according to Netiquette, all are equal here. Any are free
to ignore posters or topics they don't like, but nobody has the right
to intimidate other posters. Some posters like to pretend they have
extra rights and powers, and are able to cow some who don't know
better. Don't let it happen to you!

---
CSM

csm7532@hotmail.com said...
> > >>alt.support cancer:
> > >>High activity - 392 subscribers, 20 recent authors.
> > >>total posts so far this month - 790.
> > >>Top 10 posters wrote 405 of them.
>
> 2.5% of posters wrote 51% of posts. AFAIK, this is typical.
>
It's a well known fact[1] that there are only 200 posters on Usenet.
I'm at least 5 of them all by myself...

[1] Being a well known fact of course, it's probably fiction. Most well
known facts are :-)

--
Em

>
> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
> A. Give it to me straight doc.
> B. Be gentle with me.
> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>
> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd me.
> Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.
>
> Ian

Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with the
patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we should
be supporting each other instead of being critical?

Anyways...happy New Years to all

"Alex" <usenetgirl@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1167634959.853907.28040@42g2000cwt.googlegrou ps.com...
>
>>
>> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
>> A. Give it to me straight doc.
>> B. Be gentle with me.
>> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>>
>> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd me.
>> Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.
>>
>> Ian
>
> Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
> any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
> doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
> done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
> done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
> medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with the
> patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we should
> be supporting each other instead of being critical?
>
> Anyways...happy New Years to all
>

C'ing anyone instead of A'ing them is inexcusable.
But I get bollocked for it here regularly...............

"Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in
news:8L4mh.541040$5R2.410970@pd7urf3no:

>
> "Alex" <usenetgirl@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1167634959.853907.28040@42g2000cwt.googlegrou ps.com...
>>
>>>
>>> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
>>> A. Give it to me straight doc.
>>> B. Be gentle with me.
>>> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>>>
>>> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have
>>> A'd me. Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost
>>> impossible.
>>>
>>> Ian
>>
>> Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
>> any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
>> doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
>> done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
>> done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
>> medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with
>> the patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we
>> should be supporting each other instead of being critical?
>>
>> Anyways...happy New Years to all
>>
>
> C'ing anyone instead of A'ing them is inexcusable.
> But I get bollocked for it here regularly...............
>
I agree. When the A hits, as it will, it will be harder to take if we've
been misled by C first. But temper that A with a little B, please.

When Socks was diagnosed, the doc came into his room & told him he
unfortunately had advanced cancer that had spread - this in front of his
hospital roommate. There was no cure & he was terminal. Just like that.
There was a little private sitting room around the corner they could have
gone to, but, no,. Socks was left thinking he would die within hours or
days. He thought he'd never leave that hospital!

I'm thinking the doc could have found a way to find out if Socks wanted
me or someone else with him when the blow was dealt. Or they could have
called me to come & just be there after the doc delivered his news. So
Socks called my office & had to have me paged. By the time I was located
in a meeting, everyone else in the company already knew. And he was alone
in a hospital & babbling pitifully. The company had ordered a cab for me
immediately so I wouldn't drive my car, but a co-worker drove me instead.
I was shown more consideration than Socks was.

When I got there, he was on the phone saying goodbye to everyone &
resigning all his volunteer positions (most of which he picked right back
up). Later, in the afternoon, the hospital social workers & support
staff started pouring in, offering whatever we needed. Where were they
when this brutal delivery of factual news was delivered?

When we must fire an employee, they are told, they are given written
information about how long their benefits will continue,etc., a number to
call for an appointment with HR, resource numbers including one for
psychological help paid for by the company, etc. We recognize that once
someone has been told they are being terminated, they often hear little
else. They are also offered a cab or to call someone to come get them.
So why not have similar for someone who is being given bad medical news?
I would think the doc could have handed Socks a booklet about cancer &
told him he'd come back later to answer questions or offered to send an
onc.

Within moments of my arrival, Socks was telling me details of how he
wanted his memorial service to be. Like there was no time. That service
occurred over 4 years later.

So deliver the A but with a good helping of B, please. Or if you're not
a B person, have one with you.

Steph, I'm not aiming this at you.

Fig

>
> Within moments of my arrival, Socks was telling me details of how he
> wanted his memorial service to be. Like there was no time. That service
> occurred over 4 years later.
>
> So deliver the A but with a good helping of B, please. Or if you're not
> a B person, have one with you.
>
> Steph, I'm not aiming this at you.
>
> Fig

I am sad to see that your husband got such rotten care. I see many
doctors and nurses agonizing on how to tell patients bad news.

In fact some places have protocols on how to give the news ( make sure
the person has their support person available, leave time to answer
questions, give information, etc).

http://www.fastcompany.com/online/23/buckman.htm

http://www.childrenshospital.org/new...ublevel28.html

Where where the other health care professionals? Social Worker? Nurses?
Champlain?
It seems like a cruel situation.....

BUT I don't believe the Internet is the way to deliver bad news no
matter how well intentioned since you don't know how the message is
going to be received.

Alex

"Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in message
news:8L4mh.541040$5R2.410970@pd7urf3no...
>
> "Alex" <usenetgirl@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1167634959.853907.28040@42g2000cwt.googlegrou ps.com...
>>
>>>
>>> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
>>> A. Give it to me straight doc.
>>> B. Be gentle with me.
>>> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>>>
>>> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd
>>> me.
>>> Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.
>>>
>>> Ian
>>
>> Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
>> any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
>> doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
>> done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
>> done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
>> medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with the
>> patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we should
>> be supporting each other instead of being critical?
>>
>> Anyways...happy New Years to all
>>
>
> C'ing anyone instead of A'ing them is inexcusable.
> But I get bollocked for it here regularly...............


Rob was told about his cancer without us there. He wanted to know the truth
and they told him that he probably had 3-6 months to live. The biopsy
results were that he had a different kind of cancer than originally thought
(a GBM). I was shocked when I found out that they'd told him that without
waiting for the biopsy results to come in. I was also shocked that Rob
seemed so matter of fact about it. I found out later that he'd done a lot
of agonizing when alone. That was not a good way for the doctors to handle
the news.

Pam S.

"tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:MDimh.6299$yx6.3089@newsread2.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
>
> "Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in message
> news:8L4mh.541040$5R2.410970@pd7urf3no...
>>
>> "Alex" <usenetgirl@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1167634959.853907.28040@42g2000cwt.googlegrou ps.com...
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
>>>> A. Give it to me straight doc.
>>>> B. Be gentle with me.
>>>> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>>>>
>>>> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd
>>>> me.
>>>> Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.
>>>>
>>>> Ian
>>>
>>> Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
>>> any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
>>> doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
>>> done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
>>> done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
>>> medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with the
>>> patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we should
>>> be supporting each other instead of being critical?
>>>
>>> Anyways...happy New Years to all
>>>
>>
>> C'ing anyone instead of A'ing them is inexcusable.
>> But I get bollocked for it here regularly...............
>
>
> Rob was told about his cancer without us there. He wanted to know the
> truth and they told him that he probably had 3-6 months to live. The
> biopsy results were that he had a different kind of cancer than originally
> thought (a GBM). I was shocked when I found out that they'd told him that
> without waiting for the biopsy results to come in. I was also shocked
> that Rob seemed so matter of fact about it. I found out later that he'd
> done a lot of agonizing when alone. That was not a good way for the
> doctors to handle the news.
>
> Pam S.
>

What would be a good way?

> i'm a lurker - waitin for info relating to.......me?

With neither profile nor general information from you, I suspect that
your odds of finding material relevant to you are the equivalent of
winning MegaMillions. 8<}
With sympathy///
Popper

Raptor07 wrote:

> I'd say OldBill wasn't trying to upset anyone. He was merely just showing
> how people dealing with cancer possibly suffer in silence relating to user
> activity in this newsgroup and those people possibly find it hard to open up
> about their situation.
>
> OldBill has posted some very supportive words to other users in the past so
> you are mistaken Pam.
>
> "tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:_qBlh.8866$X72.2961@newsread3.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
> >
>
> > So? There is plenty of room for anyone who wants to write reasonable
> > posts in here. I doubt if you are one of them.
> >
> > Pam S.

As best I can recall, he's posted 2 supportive messages since being here since
Sept 19/05.
And one asking about MGUS (which isn't cancer).
And the rest are his Vitamin C fanatic posts and/or argumentative posts.
If Raptor wants to check what I say, check the archives, starting that date ;
poster "sam".
Then he changed names/email addresses a few times, so you might miss some.
J

"tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:RTUlh.5657$w91.2967@newsread1.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
>
>>> OldBill has posted some very supportive words to other users in the past
>> so you are mistaken Pam.
>>
>
> Sorry to post what I did. Bill's post hit me the wrong way at a time when
> I shouldn't have been reading USENET.

I understand, Pam, and no offence taken I promise.
Take care.

Bill Thomas
Cardiff UK.

"Ruthie" <gwhootie@mtco.com> wrote in message
news:1167575550.819267.132610@s34g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
> Bozz wrote:
>> "OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
>> news:en6iiq$bk8$2@news.datemas.de...
>> > Now and again we hear mention of
>> > "The Silent Majority" on this NG.
>> > Here are some interesting statistics from Google:
>> >
>> Would it not be logical that there were question askers and question
>> answerers, and that the answerers would post more than the askers?
>>
>> Ian
Yes it would, Ian, and I feel sure that what you say is exactly what
happens.

Bill Thomas
Cardiff UK

"OldBill" <Oldbill@splott.uk> wrote in message
news:enh1jk$vbj$2@news.datemas.de...
>
> "tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:RTUlh.5657$w91.2967@newsread1.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
>>
>>>> OldBill has posted some very supportive words to other users in the
>>>> past
>>> so you are mistaken Pam.
>>>
>>
>> Sorry to post what I did. Bill's post hit me the wrong way at a time
>> when I shouldn't have been reading USENET.
>
> I understand, Pam, and no offence taken I promise.
> Take care.
>
> Bill Thomas
> Cardiff UK.

Thanks Bill, you are a true gentleman, especially to this person who is not
any kind of a lady.
\
Pam S.

"Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in message
news:bKnmh.552826$R63.442508@pd7urf1no...
>
> "tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:MDimh.6299$yx6.3089@newsread2.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
>>
>> "Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in message
>> news:8L4mh.541040$5R2.410970@pd7urf3no...
>>>
>>> "Alex" <usenetgirl@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:1167634959.853907.28040@42g2000cwt.googlegrou ps.com...
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
>>>>> A. Give it to me straight doc.
>>>>> B. Be gentle with me.
>>>>> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>>>>>
>>>>> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd
>>>>> me.
>>>>> Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ian
>>>>
>>>> Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
>>>> any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
>>>> doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
>>>> done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
>>>> done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
>>>> medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with the
>>>> patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we should
>>>> be supporting each other instead of being critical?
>>>>
>>>> Anyways...happy New Years to all
>>>>
>>>
>>> C'ing anyone instead of A'ing them is inexcusable.
>>> But I get bollocked for it here regularly...............
>>
>>
>> Rob was told about his cancer without us there. He wanted to know the
>> truth and they told him that he probably had 3-6 months to live. The
>> biopsy results were that he had a different kind of cancer than
>> originally thought (a GBM). I was shocked when I found out that they'd
>> told him that without waiting for the biopsy results to come in. I was
>> also shocked that Rob seemed so matter of fact about it. I found out
>> later that he'd done a lot of agonizing when alone. That was not a good
>> way for the doctors to handle the news.
>>
>> Pam S.
>>
>
> What would be a good way?

There is not "good" way, but I personally feel that it would have been
better if one of us had been there to support Rob. I think waiting for the
biopsy results which gave a much more livable diagnosis would have been a
good idea, and preparing Rob a little would have been nice. Steph, there is
no good way to tell someone that they have been handed a death sentence, but
waiting until they had something more definite would have helped.

I really think this must be the hardest part of being involved in cancer
care. I wish there were an easy way to know how to tell a patient and his
family something this devastating. I wish I had that sort of wisdom and
mental courage to tell you a sure fire way of helping a patient and family
through this sort of thing. Me, I'm just a country girl trying to adjust to
a whole new lifestyle and keep our heads above water.

Pam S.

"Splenda" <splenda@whatever.net> wrote in message
> I'm one of those, "The Silent Majority"! I posted, asking for support and
> information. I got a nasty response from one of the know-it-alls, somehow
> they felt they knew me and put down my even asking the question but also
> me, for my feelings.
> ((((OldBill)))) You hang in there and keep posting. Sometimes we want to
> know statistics and if nothing else it takes our mind off our personal
> grief/fear/worry.
> Ellen
>
Thank you, Ellen. Sorry to hear you received such an unkind welcome when
you first joined.
The constitution says:

The members of alt.support.cancer must be overly considerate
and protective of the newbie ...

It also says:

Be polite.

(hope you're beginning to chuckle a bit). Also

Understand that these are other human beings you are communicating with
that normal legitimacies and proprieties that are appropriate in public
are
applicable in alt.support.cancer.

So they are not following it are they? What can be said in their favour ?
Well they could be patients themselves and may be thinking
"You should complain, what about me?", or they may have lost a loved one.
We don't know do we ?
Nevertheless you should not have received an unkind welcome and I am sorry
you did.

"J" <nexsw@nvalid,anon> wrote in message
news:459AE8A8.81623D57@execulink.com...
>>> OldBill has posted some very supportive words to other users in the past
>>> so
>> you are mistaken Pam.
>>

> As best I can recall, he's posted 2 supportive messages since being here
> since
> Sept 19/05.
> And one asking about MGUS (which isn't cancer).
> And the rest are his Vitamin C fanatic posts and/or argumentative posts.
> If Raptor wants to check what I say, check the archives, starting that
> date ;
> poster "sam".
> Then he changed names/email addresses a few times, so you might miss some.
> J

Hello J,
Back on form after a jolly break for Christmas?
Sorry your memory aint so good these days. It happens
to many people I understand.
Happy New Year.

Bill Thomas
Cardiff UK.

Steph schreef:
> What would be a good way?
>
>
>
For me a good way was: I'm very sorry to say that I have very bad news.
Your cancer spread throughout the body and there is no cure. That was
may 2005.


Anne

>>>>>> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
>>>>>> A. Give it to me straight doc.
>>>>>> B. Be gentle with me.
>>>>>> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd
>>>>>> me.
>>>>>> Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ian
>>>>>
>>>>> Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
>>>>> any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
>>>>> doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
>>>>> done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
>>>>> done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
>>>>> medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with
>>>>> the
>>>>> patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we should
>>>>> be supporting each other instead of being critical?
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyways...happy New Years to all
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> C'ing anyone instead of A'ing them is inexcusable.
>>>> But I get bollocked for it here regularly...............
>>>
>>>
>>> Rob was told about his cancer without us there. He wanted to know the
>>> truth and they told him that he probably had 3-6 months to live. The
>>> biopsy results were that he had a different kind of cancer than
>>> originally thought (a GBM). I was shocked when I found out that they'd
>>> told him that without waiting for the biopsy results to come in. I was
>>> also shocked that Rob seemed so matter of fact about it. I found out
>>> later that he'd done a lot of agonizing when alone. That was not a good
>>> way for the doctors to handle the news.
>>>
>>> Pam S.
>>>
>>
>> What would be a good way?
>
> There is not "good" way, but I personally feel that it would have been
> better if one of us had been there to support Rob. I think waiting for
> the biopsy results which gave a much more livable diagnosis would have
> been a good idea, and preparing Rob a little would have been nice. Steph,
> there is no good way to tell someone that they have been handed a death
> sentence, but waiting until they had something more definite would have
> helped.
>
> I really think this must be the hardest part of being involved in cancer
> care. I wish there were an easy way to know how to tell a patient and his
> family something this devastating. I wish I had that sort of wisdom and
> mental courage to tell you a sure fire way of helping a patient and family
> through this sort of thing. Me, I'm just a country girl trying to adjust
> to a whole new lifestyle and keep our heads above water.
>
> Pam S.

If a patient asks then he must be told. It is not up to doctors to decide
whether he is 'up to it' or not or whether he should have someone with
him/her unless, possibly, if there is some documented evidence that may make
giving that kind of news 'harmful'. Of course if the doctor suggests waiting
until there is a relative or friend to be present then he has already given
a good deal of the news anyway. These things are never easy.
MIKE

"tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:mjUmh.6994$w91.4068@newsread1.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
>
> "Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in message
> news:bKnmh.552826$R63.442508@pd7urf1no...
>>
>> "tanada" <tanada@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>> news:MDimh.6299$yx6.3089@newsread2.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
>>>
>>> "Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in message
>>> news:8L4mh.541040$5R2.410970@pd7urf3no...
>>>>
>>>> "Alex" <usenetgirl@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:1167634959.853907.28040@42g2000cwt.googlegrou ps.com...
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe we need a graded response scale:
>>>>>> A. Give it to me straight doc.
>>>>>> B. Be gentle with me.
>>>>>> C. Tell me what I want to hear/placate me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I say this knowing that doctors have C'd me when that should have A'd
>>>>>> me.
>>>>>> Not easy to judge face to face, on a news group almost impossible.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ian
>>>>>
>>>>> Ian I think you hit the nail on the head.....NO one should be giving
>>>>> any medical advice do to the complexities of not being a qualified
>>>>> doctor , who has completed a full review of the medical records and
>>>>> done a COMPLETE assesment of the situation. Most often this should be
>>>>> done privately.....since often it is the family member discussing
>>>>> medical issues and health care professionals should be dealing with
>>>>> the
>>>>> patient directly..... as you said It is impossible, perhaps we should
>>>>> be supporting each other instead of being critical?
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyways...happy New Years to all
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> C'ing anyone instead of A'ing them is inexcusable.
>>>> But I get bollocked for it here regularly...............
>>>
>>>
>>> Rob was told about his cancer without us there. He wanted to know the
>>> truth and they told him that he probably had 3-6 months to live. The
>>> biopsy results were that he had a different kind of cancer than
>>> originally thought (a GBM). I was shocked when I found out that they'd
>>> told him that without waiting for the biopsy results to come in. I was
>>> also shocked that Rob seemed so matter of fact about it. I found out
>>> later that he'd done a lot of agonizing when alone. That was not a good
>>> way for the doctors to handle the news.
>>>
>>> Pam S.
>>>
>>
>> What would be a good way?
>
> There is not "good" way, but I personally feel that it would have been
> better if one of us had been there to support Rob. I think waiting for
> the biopsy results which gave a much more livable diagnosis would have
> been a good idea, and preparing Rob a little would have been nice. Steph,
> there is no good way to tell someone that they have been handed a death
> sentence, but waiting until they had something more definite would have
> helped.
>
> I really think this must be the hardest part of being involved in cancer
> care. I wish there were an easy way to know how to tell a patient and his
> family something this devastating. I wish I had that sort of wisdom and
> mental courage to tell you a sure fire way of helping a patient and family
> through this sort of thing. Me, I'm just a country girl trying to adjust
> to a whole new lifestyle and keep our heads above water.
>
> Pam S.
>

And me, I'm just an oncologist who has tell people these kinds of things
every day.
It's very easy to complain about how it's done if you don't have to do it.
And remember, the physician has a primary ethical responsibility to the
patient, not the family or anyone else.

"starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:459c6a75$0$714$5fc3050@dreader2.news.tiscali. nl...
> Steph schreef:
>> What would be a good way?
>>
>>
> For me a good way was: I'm very sorry to say that I have very bad news.
> Your cancer spread throughout the body and there is no cure. That was may
> 2005.
>
>
> Anne
>

And that is really the only way........

"Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island> wrote in message
news:YZ1nh.552644$5R2.404105@pd7urf3no...
>
> "starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:459c6a75$0$714$5fc3050@dreader2.news.tiscali. nl...
>> Steph schreef:
>>> What would be a good way?
>>>
>>>
>> For me a good way was: I'm very sorry to say that I have very bad news.
>> Your cancer spread throughout the body and there is no cure. That was may
>> 2005.
>>
>>
>> Anne
>>
>
> And that is really the only way........

I'm not really sure that is the only way. OK for us it was and it was what
we wanted and needed. On the other hand my next door neighbour was in his
mid 70's, not at all medical, by himself and maybe a little bit confused at
being out of his normal environment and post op. They told him on the ward
round, he broke down and they had to do it all again later with the
relatives anyway. Later, when we talked to them, they couldn't even
pronounce oncologist let alone know what one was.

It's not black and white but many shades of grey. The truth needs to be
communicated, but in a way that suits the situation. Steph, here on a
support group, can not read the situation so just gives the factual reply.
I'm not sure that would be "enough" in a clinic situation.

Ian