Carbohydrate is necessay for diabetes.......

These data indicate that the combination of obesity, insulin resistance and
the inflammatory response of adipose tissue are insufficient to cause beta
cell destruction in the absence of dietary carbohydrate.


Diabetologia. 2007 Apr 17;
Development of diabetes in obese, insulin-resistant mice: essential role of
dietary carbohydrate in beta cell destruction.

AIMS/HYPOTHESIS: The role of dietary carbohydrate in the pathogenesis of
type 2 diabetes is still a subject of controversial debate. Here we analysed
the effects of diets with and without carbohydrate on obesity, insulin
resistance and development of beta cell failure in the obese, diabetes-prone
New Zealand Obese (NZO) mouse. MATERIALS AND METHODS: NZO mice were kept on
a standard diet (4% [w/w] fat, 51% carbohydrate, 19% protein), a high-fat
diet (15, 47 and 17%, respectively) and a carbohydrate-free diet in which
carbohydrate was exchanged for fat (68 and 20%, respectively). Body
composition and blood glucose were measured over a period of 22 weeks.
Glucose tolerance tests and euglycaemic-hyperinsulinaemic clamps were
performed to analyse insulin sensitivity. Islet morphology was assessed by
immunohistochemistry. RESULTS: Mice on carbohydrate-containing standard or
high-fat diets developed severe diabetes (blood glucose >16.6 mmol/l,
glucosuria) due to selective destruction of pancreatic beta cells associated
with severe loss of immunoreactivity of insulin, glucose transporter 2
(GLUT2) and musculoaponeurotic fibrosarcoma oncogene homologue A (MafA). In
contrast, mice on the carbohydrate-free diet remained normoglycaemic and
exhibited hyperplastic islets in spite of a morbid obesity associated with
severe insulin resistance and a massive accumulation of macrophages in
adipose tissue. CONCLUSIONS/INTERPRETATION: These data indicate that the
combination of obesity, insulin resistance and the inflammatory response of
adipose tissue are insufficient to cause beta cell destruction in the
absence of dietary carbohydrate.

PMID: 17437079

hth
Gys

x-no-archive: yes

GysdeJongh wrote:

> Diabetologia. 2007 Apr 17;
> Development of diabetes in obese, insulin-resistant mice: essential role of
> dietary carbohydrate in beta cell destruction.
>
> AIMS/HYPOTHESIS: The role of dietary carbohydrate in the pathogenesis of
> type 2 diabetes is still a subject of controversial debate. Here we analysed
> the effects of diets with and without carbohydrate on obesity, insulin
> resistance and development of beta cell failure in the obese, diabetes-prone
> New Zealand Obese (NZO) mouse. MATERIALS AND METHODS: NZO mice were kept on
> a standard diet (4% [w/w] fat, 51% carbohydrate, 19% protein), a high-fat
> diet (15, 47 and 17%, respectively) and a carbohydrate-free diet in which
> carbohydrate was exchanged for fat (68 and 20%, respectively). Body
> composition and blood glucose were measured over a period of 22 weeks.
> Glucose tolerance tests and euglycaemic-hyperinsulinaemic clamps were
> performed to analyse insulin sensitivity. Islet morphology was assessed by
> immunohistochemistry. RESULTS: Mice on carbohydrate-containing standard or
> high-fat diets developed severe diabetes (blood glucose >16.6 mmol/l,
> glucosuria) due to selective destruction of pancreatic beta cells associated
> with severe loss of immunoreactivity of insulin, glucose transporter 2
> (GLUT2) and musculoaponeurotic fibrosarcoma oncogene homologue A (MafA). In
> contrast, mice on the carbohydrate-free diet remained normoglycaemic and
> exhibited hyperplastic islets in spite of a morbid obesity associated with
> severe insulin resistance and a massive accumulation of macrophages in
> adipose tissue. CONCLUSIONS/INTERPRETATION: These data indicate that the
> combination of obesity, insulin resistance and the inflammatory response of
> adipose tissue are insufficient to cause beta cell destruction in the
> absence of dietary carbohydrate.
>
> PMID: 17437079

This is why I reject the heredity determinism some buy in to about DM.

Genes predispose one to it, but it's not inevitable if one eats in a way
that preserves beta cells.

Susan

Susan wrote:

> x-no-archive: yes
>
> GysdeJongh wrote:
>
>> Diabetologia. 2007 Apr 17;
>> Development of diabetes in obese, insulin-resistant mice: essential
>> role of dietary carbohydrate in beta cell destruction.
>>
>> AIMS/HYPOTHESIS: The role of dietary carbohydrate in the pathogenesis
>> of type 2 diabetes is still a subject of controversial debate. Here we
>> analysed the effects of diets with and without carbohydrate on
>> obesity, insulin resistance and development of beta cell failure in
>> the obese, diabetes-prone New Zealand Obese (NZO) mouse. MATERIALS AND
>> METHODS: NZO mice were kept on a standard diet (4% [w/w] fat, 51%
>> carbohydrate, 19% protein), a high-fat diet (15, 47 and 17%,
>> respectively) and a carbohydrate-free diet in which carbohydrate was
>> exchanged for fat (68 and 20%, respectively). Body composition and
>> blood glucose were measured over a period of 22 weeks. Glucose
>> tolerance tests and euglycaemic-hyperinsulinaemic clamps were
>> performed to analyse insulin sensitivity. Islet morphology was
>> assessed by immunohistochemistry. RESULTS: Mice on
>> carbohydrate-containing standard or high-fat diets developed severe
>> diabetes (blood glucose >16.6 mmol/l, glucosuria) due to selective
>> destruction of pancreatic beta cells associated with severe loss of
>> immunoreactivity of insulin, glucose transporter 2 (GLUT2) and
>> musculoaponeurotic fibrosarcoma oncogene homologue A (MafA). In
>> contrast, mice on the carbohydrate-free diet remained normoglycaemic
>> and exhibited hyperplastic islets in spite of a morbid obesity
>> associated with severe insulin resistance and a massive accumulation
>> of macrophages in adipose tissue. CONCLUSIONS/INTERPRETATION: These
>> data indicate that the combination of obesity, insulin resistance and
>> the inflammatory response of adipose tissue are insufficient to cause
>> beta cell destruction in the absence of dietary carbohydrate.
>>
>> PMID: 17437079
>
>
> This is why I reject the heredity determinism some buy in to about DM.
>
> Genes predispose one to it, but it's not inevitable if one eats in a way
> that preserves beta cells.
>
> Susan

Genes may load the gun, but carbs fire the trigger.

V.

This is a lot of technical jargon to me, All I know is that if I dont
have carbs with my meals or in between, I get low and dont feel well.
Thats the information I need to know.

Loretta

On Sat, 28 Apr 2007 13:40:37 -0400, sassybklynlady@webtv.net (Loretta
Eisenberg) wrote:

>This is a lot of technical jargon to me, All I know is that if I dont
>have carbs with my meals or in between, I get low and dont feel well.
>Thats the information I need to know.
>
>Loretta

I think the logical conclusion is the old recommendation of moderation
in all things - "except humor" as one of our favorite posters likes to
say.
--

Grandpa Chuck
-ô¿ô-
~

Americans killed in Iraq as of April 26, 2007 is 3,337.
United Kingdom = 145 Other = 125.

How many more Americans must die to satisfy Bush's ego?

As of April 28, 2007 it has been 1476 days since Bush
while standing in front of the banner which was sent
to the ship by the White House saying MISSION ACCOMPLISHED
declared,"In the Battle of Iraq, the United States and our
allies have prevailed." IOW MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag, and carrying a cross." --Sinclair
Lewis

sassybklynlady@webtv.net (Loretta Eisenberg) wrote in part:

>This is a lot of technical jargon to me, All I know is that if I dont
>have carbs with my meals or in between, I get low and dont feel well.
>Thats the information I need to know.
>
>Loretta

You may have adapted in some ways to the high blood sugar (assuming yours is
too high). Sometimes it takes a while to have everything normalize when one
thing in the body is changed.
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

Jim, my A1c is 5.7. I have pretty tight control and dont have high
numbers. I am on byetta and they keep me in a range of about 75 to 115
preprandial and postprandial.

I have been here for many years. If you are new, I want to welcome you
to our group

Loretta

On Apr 28, 8:20 am, Susan <neverm...@nomail.com> wrote:
> x-no-archive: yes
>
>
>
>
>
> GysdeJongh wrote:
> > Diabetologia. 2007 Apr 17;
> > Development of diabetes in obese, insulin-resistant mice: essential role of
> > dietary carbohydrate in beta cell destruction.
>
> > AIMS/HYPOTHESIS: The role of dietary carbohydrate in the pathogenesis of
> > type 2 diabetes is still a subject of controversial debate. Here we analysed
> > the effects of diets with and without carbohydrate on obesity, insulin
> > resistance and development of beta cell failure in the obese, diabetes-prone
> > New Zealand Obese (NZO) mouse. MATERIALS AND METHODS: NZO mice were kept on
> > a standard diet (4% [w/w] fat, 51% carbohydrate, 19% protein), a high-fat
> > diet (15, 47 and 17%, respectively) and a carbohydrate-free diet in which
> > carbohydrate was exchanged for fat (68 and 20%, respectively). Body
> > composition and blood glucose were measured over a period of 22 weeks.
> > Glucose tolerance tests and euglycaemic-hyperinsulinaemic clamps were
> > performed to analyse insulin sensitivity. Islet morphology was assessed by
> > immunohistochemistry. RESULTS: Mice on carbohydrate-containing standard or
> > high-fat diets developed severe diabetes (blood glucose >16.6 mmol/l,
> > glucosuria) due to selective destruction of pancreatic beta cells associated
> > with severe loss of immunoreactivity of insulin, glucose transporter 2
> > (GLUT2) and musculoaponeurotic fibrosarcoma oncogene homologue A (MafA). In
> > contrast, mice on the carbohydrate-free diet remained normoglycaemic and
> > exhibited hyperplastic islets in spite of a morbid obesity associated with
> > severe insulin resistance and a massive accumulation of macrophages in
> > adipose tissue. CONCLUSIONS/INTERPRETATION: These data indicate that the
> > combination of obesity, insulin resistance and the inflammatory response of
> > adipose tissue are insufficient to cause beta cell destruction in the
> > absence of dietary carbohydrate.
>
> > PMID: 17437079
>
> This is why I reject the heredity determinism some buy in to about DM.
>
> Genes predispose one to it, but it's not inevitable if one eats in a way
> that preserves beta cells.
>
> Susan- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

That's nice.

"Susan" <nevermind@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:59gsfdF2l3ogdU1@mid.individual.net...
> x-no-archive: yes
>
> GysdeJongh wrote:
>
> > Diabetologia. 2007 Apr 17;
> > Development of diabetes in obese, insulin-resistant mice: essential role
of
> > dietary carbohydrate in beta cell destruction.
> >
> > AIMS/HYPOTHESIS: The role of dietary carbohydrate in the pathogenesis of
> > type 2 diabetes is still a subject of controversial debate. Here we
analysed
> > the effects of diets with and without carbohydrate on obesity, insulin
> > resistance and development of beta cell failure in the obese,
diabetes-prone
> > New Zealand Obese (NZO) mouse. MATERIALS AND METHODS: NZO mice were kept
on
> > a standard diet (4% [w/w] fat, 51% carbohydrate, 19% protein), a
high-fat
> > diet (15, 47 and 17%, respectively) and a carbohydrate-free diet in
which
> > carbohydrate was exchanged for fat (68 and 20%, respectively). Body
> > composition and blood glucose were measured over a period of 22 weeks.
> > Glucose tolerance tests and euglycaemic-hyperinsulinaemic clamps were
> > performed to analyse insulin sensitivity. Islet morphology was assessed
by
> > immunohistochemistry. RESULTS: Mice on carbohydrate-containing standard
or
> > high-fat diets developed severe diabetes (blood glucose >16.6 mmol/l,
> > glucosuria) due to selective destruction of pancreatic beta cells
associated
> > with severe loss of immunoreactivity of insulin, glucose transporter 2
> > (GLUT2) and musculoaponeurotic fibrosarcoma oncogene homologue A (MafA).
In
> > contrast, mice on the carbohydrate-free diet remained normoglycaemic and
> > exhibited hyperplastic islets in spite of a morbid obesity associated
with
> > severe insulin resistance and a massive accumulation of macrophages in
> > adipose tissue. CONCLUSIONS/INTERPRETATION: These data indicate that the
> > combination of obesity, insulin resistance and the inflammatory response
of
> > adipose tissue are insufficient to cause beta cell destruction in the
> > absence of dietary carbohydrate.
> >
> > PMID: 17437079
>
> This is why I reject the heredity determinism some buy in to about DM.
>
> Genes predispose one to it, but it's not inevitable if one eats in a way
> that preserves beta cells.

Nor (IMO) is diabetic progression an abolute.

On Apr 28, 5:49 pm, "Ozgirl" <are_we_there_...@maccas.com> wrote:
> "Susan" <neverm...@nomail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:59gsfdF2l3ogdU1@mid.individual.net...
>
>
>
>
>
> > x-no-archive: yes
>
> > GysdeJongh wrote:
>
> > > Diabetologia. 2007 Apr 17;
> > > Development of diabetes in obese, insulin-resistant mice: essential role
> of
> > > dietary carbohydrate in beta cell destruction.
>
> > > AIMS/HYPOTHESIS: The role of dietary carbohydrate in the pathogenesis of
> > > type 2 diabetes is still a subject of controversial debate. Here we
> analysed
> > > the effects of diets with and without carbohydrate on obesity, insulin
> > > resistance and development of beta cell failure in the obese,
> diabetes-prone
> > > New Zealand Obese (NZO) mouse. MATERIALS AND METHODS: NZO mice were kept
> on
> > > a standard diet (4% [w/w] fat, 51% carbohydrate, 19% protein), a
> high-fat
> > > diet (15, 47 and 17%, respectively) and a carbohydrate-free diet in
> which
> > > carbohydrate was exchanged for fat (68 and 20%, respectively). Body
> > > composition and blood glucose were measured over a period of 22 weeks.
> > > Glucose tolerance tests and euglycaemic-hyperinsulinaemic clamps were
> > > performed to analyse insulin sensitivity. Islet morphology was assessed
> by
> > > immunohistochemistry. RESULTS: Mice on carbohydrate-containing standard
> or
> > > high-fat diets developed severe diabetes (blood glucose >16.6 mmol/l,
> > > glucosuria) due to selective destruction of pancreatic beta cells
> associated
> > > with severe loss of immunoreactivity of insulin, glucose transporter 2
> > > (GLUT2) and musculoaponeurotic fibrosarcoma oncogene homologue A (MafA).
> In
> > > contrast, mice on the carbohydrate-free diet remained normoglycaemic and
> > > exhibited hyperplastic islets in spite of a morbid obesity associated
> with
> > > severe insulin resistance and a massive accumulation of macrophages in
> > > adipose tissue. CONCLUSIONS/INTERPRETATION: These data indicate that the
> > > combination of obesity, insulin resistance and the inflammatory response
> of
> > > adipose tissue are insufficient to cause beta cell destruction in the
> > > absence of dietary carbohydrate.
>
> > > PMID: 17437079
>
> > This is why I reject the heredity determinism some buy in to about DM.
>
> > Genes predispose one to it, but it's not inevitable if one eats in a way
> > that preserves beta cells.
>
> Nor (IMO) is diabetic progression an abolute.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Does it really matter if diabetes progresses? In 40 years it wont
matter what we ate.

<wingmask@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1177797616.723671.282320@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
> On Apr 28, 5:49 pm, "Ozgirl" <are_we_there_...@maccas.com> wrote:
> > "Susan" <neverm...@nomail.com> wrote in message
> >
> > news:59gsfdF2l3ogdU1@mid.individual.net...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > x-no-archive: yes
> >
> > > GysdeJongh wrote:
> >
> > > > Diabetologia. 2007 Apr 17;
> > > > Development of diabetes in obese, insulin-resistant mice: essential
role
> > of
> > > > dietary carbohydrate in beta cell destruction.
> >
> > > > AIMS/HYPOTHESIS: The role of dietary carbohydrate in the
pathogenesis of
> > > > type 2 diabetes is still a subject of controversial debate. Here we
> > analysed
> > > > the effects of diets with and without carbohydrate on obesity,
insulin
> > > > resistance and development of beta cell failure in the obese,
> > diabetes-prone
> > > > New Zealand Obese (NZO) mouse. MATERIALS AND METHODS: NZO mice were
kept
> > on
> > > > a standard diet (4% [w/w] fat, 51% carbohydrate, 19% protein), a
> > high-fat
> > > > diet (15, 47 and 17%, respectively) and a carbohydrate-free diet in
> > which
> > > > carbohydrate was exchanged for fat (68 and 20%, respectively). Body
> > > > composition and blood glucose were measured over a period of 22
weeks.
> > > > Glucose tolerance tests and euglycaemic-hyperinsulinaemic clamps
were
> > > > performed to analyse insulin sensitivity. Islet morphology was
assessed
> > by
> > > > immunohistochemistry. RESULTS: Mice on carbohydrate-containing
standard
> > or
> > > > high-fat diets developed severe diabetes (blood glucose >16.6
mmol/l,
> > > > glucosuria) due to selective destruction of pancreatic beta cells
> > associated
> > > > with severe loss of immunoreactivity of insulin, glucose transporter
2
> > > > (GLUT2) and musculoaponeurotic fibrosarcoma oncogene homologue A
(MafA).
> > In
> > > > contrast, mice on the carbohydrate-free diet remained normoglycaemic
and
> > > > exhibited hyperplastic islets in spite of a morbid obesity
associated
> > with
> > > > severe insulin resistance and a massive accumulation of macrophages
in
> > > > adipose tissue. CONCLUSIONS/INTERPRETATION: These data indicate that
the
> > > > combination of obesity, insulin resistance and the inflammatory
response
> > of
> > > > adipose tissue are insufficient to cause beta cell destruction in
the
> > > > absence of dietary carbohydrate.
> >
> > > > PMID: 17437079
> >
> > > This is why I reject the heredity determinism some buy in to about DM.
> >
> > > Genes predispose one to it, but it's not inevitable if one eats in a
way
> > > that preserves beta cells.
> >
> > Nor (IMO) is diabetic progression an abolute.- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Does it really matter if diabetes progresses? In 40 years it wont
> matter what we ate.

I prefer not to suffer complications - quality of life is important to me.

Wingmask, if we dont watch what we eat now, there wont be a future of
forty years.

Loretta

x-no-archive: yes


Jim Chinnis wrote:

> You may have adapted in some ways to the high blood sugar (assuming yours is
> too high). Sometimes it takes a while to have everything normalize when one
> thing in the body is changed.
> --
> Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA


I think it has more to do with the meds she's taken; they can cause lows.

Susan

At my age, forty years is not in the picture, but it's this year that
counts, and if I make that, it's the next year...and so on. :-)


Cheri


Loretta Eisenberg wrote in message
<27066-4633C685-186@storefull-3234.bay.webtv.net>...
Wingmask, if we dont watch what we eat now, there wont be a future of
forty years.

Loretta

sassybklynlady@webtv.net (Loretta Eisenberg) wrote in part:

>Jim, my A1c is 5.7. I have pretty tight control and dont have high
>numbers. I am on byetta and they keep me in a range of about 75 to 115
>preprandial and postprandial.

Wonderful!

>I have been here for many years. If you are new, I want to welcome you
>to our group

Thank you. I am here mostly because I am trying not to become a diabetic.
There is a lot of wisdom here.
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

Susan <nevermind@nomail.com> wrote in part:

>x-no-archive: yes
>
>
>Jim Chinnis wrote:
>
>> You may have adapted in some ways to the high blood sugar (assuming yours is
>> too high). Sometimes it takes a while to have everything normalize when one
>> thing in the body is changed.
>> --
>> Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA
>
>
>I think it has more to do with the meds she's taken; they can cause lows.
>
>Susan

Point taken. I don't know the people here.
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

In alt.support.diabetes on Sun, 29 Apr 2007 00:34:14 GMT in Msg.#
<vsp733dj3e8ki9rr71vmnhgp0onvojdqkb@4ax.com>, Jim Chinnis
<jchinnis@SPAMalum.mit.edu> wrote:

> ... I am here mostly because I am trying not to become a diabetic.

Have you figured that out yet?

--
DonnaB
06-07-06 Diagnosis T2 hbA1C 8.1, D&E & Metformin 500mg.
...................09-11-06 hbA1C 5.0
...................12-20-06 hbA1C 5.2

"Words set things in motion. I’ve seen them doing it. Words set up
atmospheres, electrical fields, charges." - Toni Cade Bambara

Like everything else about us, we're all different: for those of us who are
"Lada" or type 1 1/2, or MODY, or any of the other current designations, we
can stave things off, sometimes for quite a few years, but not forever.
Others, with other genes, have different prospects. I hope better
--
Judy G/dx T2 12-2001, metformin; went to pm insulin 2003; on the way to
twice a day insulin 2007. Normal weight/cholesterol/bp. Go figure: life
ain't fair