Metformin...

Hi lovely people!

I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
to be given Metformin automatically.

Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
August?

If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about reasons
for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true* diabetic
(she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
appointment.

I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to under 6
(108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost over
28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may be
that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.

I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!

Thanks.

Hi Helen, I was not offered Metformin either. In fact I have just had my
physical and am waiting the blood results, but I talked to my doctor
about concerns of not being able to keep the BGs in control UNLESS my
carb intake was down around 60/day. I have trouble keeping it that low
but if I do my testing is in the normal range. He felt that it was more
important the the BGs were low and was not concerned about the low
carbs. I even told him that the dietician had told me that I should have
the 130g of carbs/day that seems to be the usual recommendation. He does
not want me on meds until I can no longer keep the BGs low on my own.
I am still deciding on how good I think he is with diabetics but I liked
what I heard at this appointment. However he had never asked about my
feet, which tingle somewhat.
I will report on my numbers tomorrow if I get the results back.
Take care and be glad that you can control without the meds for now, I
think that they may be used as a crutch by most and they don't changed
their habits or poor eating and lack of exercise. Down the road they may
be forced to when the meds no longer do the trick. JMO,


Sally, T2
Diagnosed Feb. 2007
Diet & Exercise

Helen Back wrote:
> Hi lovely people!
>
> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
> to be given Metformin automatically.
>
> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
> August?
>
> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about reasons
> for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true* diabetic
> (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
> LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
> pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
> appointment.
>
> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to under 6
> (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost over
> 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may be
> that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
> newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>
> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> \
No, many doctors give nothing at first, and try diet and exercise (which
seems to be working for you)
Others give glipizide, and yet others try some of the newer drugs.
You will probably need drugs at some time in the future, but I envy you
in that, at least for now, you have control without them,

"ted rosenberg" <tedrosenberg@iname.com> wrote in message
news:fgn3d9$tck$1@aioe.org...
> Helen Back wrote:
>> Hi lovely people!
>>
>> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
>> appear to be given Metformin automatically.
>>
>> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
>> August?
>>
>> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
>> reasons for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
>> diabetic (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out
>> later is LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put
>> too much pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at
>> another appointment.
>>
>> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
>> under 6 (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!),
>> Ive lost over 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have
>> improved - so it may be that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just
>> wondering why, as most newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even
>> offered it.
>>
>> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> \
> No, many doctors give nothing at first, and try diet and exercise (which
> seems to be working for you)
> Others give glipizide, and yet others try some of the newer drugs.
> You will probably need drugs at some time in the future, but I envy you in
> that, at least for now, you have control without them,

I've worked hard and had ALOT of help from all of you!!

I've even persuaded my two teenage boys to eat the same as me as well - and
the transistion has been quite easy.

As I have said in the past - nothing like a good scare to kick start a
person!!

But I take nothing for granted.

Thank you.

Thanks Sally ))


"sally" <sallyvel@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:LcEXi.12034$9F1.4781@read1.cgocable.net...
>
> Hi Helen, I was not offered Metformin either. In fact I have just had my
> physical and am waiting the blood results, but I talked to my doctor
> about concerns of not being able to keep the BGs in control UNLESS my
> carb intake was down around 60/day. I have trouble keeping it that low
> but if I do my testing is in the normal range. He felt that it was more
> important the the BGs were low and was not concerned about the low
> carbs. I even told him that the dietician had told me that I should have
> the 130g of carbs/day that seems to be the usual recommendation. He does
> not want me on meds until I can no longer keep the BGs low on my own.
> I am still deciding on how good I think he is with diabetics but I liked
> what I heard at this appointment. However he had never asked about my
> feet, which tingle somewhat.
> I will report on my numbers tomorrow if I get the results back.
> Take care and be glad that you can control without the meds for now, I
> think that they may be used as a crutch by most and they don't changed
> their habits or poor eating and lack of exercise. Down the road they may
> be forced to when the meds no longer do the trick. JMO,
>
>
> Sally, T2
> Diagnosed Feb. 2007
> Diet & Exercise

Helen Back <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
: Hi lovely people!

: I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
: to be given Metformin automatically.

: Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
: August?

: If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about reasons
: for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true* diabetic
: (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
: LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
: pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
: appointment.

: I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to under 6
: (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost over
: 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may be
: that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
: newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.

: I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!

: Thanks.


Many doctors I know like to try diet and exercise first if they think they
have a cooperative patient. If that doesn't work, then metformin is
usually the first drug to be tried. It lookslike your weird diagnosis may
well leve you able to control on diet and exercise(D&E) alone! That woudl
be gret too. Wy take more meds than you need?

Wendy

In article <LcEXi.12034$9F1.4781@read1.cgocable.net>,
sally <sallyvel@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Helen, I was not offered Metformin either. In fact I have just had my
> physical and am waiting the blood results, but I talked to my doctor
> about concerns of not being able to keep the BGs in control UNLESS my
> carb intake was down around 60/day. I have trouble keeping it that low
> but if I do my testing is in the normal range. He felt that it was more
> important the the BGs were low and was not concerned about the low
> carbs.

On the one hand, this is good and on the other bad. Low carbs aren't
bad for you medically, but if you're struggling with a sense of
deprivation and feeling like your quality of life has taken a hit, those
aren't things for him to ignore.

> I even told him that the dietician had told me that I should have
> the 130g of carbs/day that seems to be the usual recommendation.

It sounds like he knows that's inaccurate, which is a good sign. One's
brain may need glucose, but that glucose can be just as well procured
from protein as from carbs, and it's slower when it's from protein and
thus much less likely to cause the kind of damaging BG spikes that carb
consumption can produce.

> He does
> not want me on meds until I can no longer keep the BGs low on my own.

Good on one hand, not as good on another. The primary reason for taking
metformin is not for BG control. It protects the heart from the effects
of insulin resistance and can have good effects on lipids, especially
HDL. I had to go off metformin because of GI effects that had become
chronic, and my HDL dropped 8 points. :-(

> I am still deciding on how good I think he is with diabetics but I liked
> what I heard at this appointment. However he had never asked about my
> feet, which tingle somewhat.

Not a good sign re: his knowledge.

> I will report on my numbers tomorrow if I get the results back.
> Take care and be glad that you can control without the meds for now, I
> think that they may be used as a crutch by most and they don't changed
> their habits or poor eating and lack of exercise. Down the road they may
> be forced to when the meds no longer do the trick. JMO,

I'm not so sure that's true. Not the last sentence, the preceeding one.

Priscilla, T2, diet & exercise, last A1c 5.6

On Nov 5, 6:39?am, "W. Baker" <wba...@panix.com> wrote:
> Helen Back <SiriusC...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>
> : Hi lovely people!
>
> : I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
> : to be given Metformin automatically.
>
> : Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
> : August?
>
> : If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about reasons
> : for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true* diabetic
> : (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
> : LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
> : pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
> : appointment.
>
> : I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to under 6
> : (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost over
> : 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may be
> : that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
> : newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>
> : I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>
> : Thanks.
>
> Many doctors I know like to try diet and exercise first if they think they
> have a cooperative patient. If that doesn't work, then metformin is
> usually the first drug to be tried. It lookslike your weird diagnosis may
> well leve you able to control on diet and exercise(D&E) alone! That woudl
> be gret too. Wy take more meds than you need?
>
> Wendy

Priscilla: Primary indication per package insert for metformin is
better control of blood glucose levels. Improved IR helps this process
in diabetics, and as a result may have protective effects on
cardiovascular system in some individuals at risk. Comorbidities also
factor into these risks. I don't think metformin is recommended to be
used by non diabetic obese individuals for cardiovascular protective
reasons per the FDA.

Larry

Helen Back wrote:

> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
> to be given Metformin automatically.
>
> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
> August?

My doc first put me on Glipizide without Metformin. When I attended a
support group meeting and listened to a respected Endocrinologist, she
told our group that Metformin was the accepted first line of medication
among her profession, followed by a sulfonylurea like Glipizide if
necessary. I talked to my doctor following this info and she put me on
Metformin.

Another well known doctor, Dr. Richard K. Bernstein, advises Type IIs to
go with Metformin followed by insulin, as early as possible, if necessary.

There are many new therapies available now that were not on the market
when this history of mine occurred.

Many doctors believe that the best road is diet and exercise if you can
achieve good numbers without meds.

Also, Metformin presents the problem of lactic acidosis for the very
elderly and those with kidney and liver problems or congestive heart
failure.

Also, Metformin affects the gastrointestinal tract for many and must be
introduced gradually.

You should read what Dr. Bernstein has to say about achieving "near
normal numbers." He's the strictist of physicians who believes that
tight control including tight carb restriction is best in the long run.

I prefer strict to loose, personally.


Type II since 5/98
Metformin and Insulin
Diet of green veggies, nuts and lean proteins
Daily exercise-walking, weights, cycling
Last A1C 5.1

"Helen Back" <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4rDXi.20757$FQ2.17433@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
> Hi lovely people!
>
> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
> appear to be given Metformin automatically.
>
> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
> August?
>
> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
> reasons for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
> diabetic (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out
> later is LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put
> too much pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at
> another appointment.
>
> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to under
> 6 (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost
> over 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it
> may be that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as
> most newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>
> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>
> Thanks.

I have no comment on if your doctor is right or wrong.
we are all different and will not always do good on a path where someone
else is doing perfectly.
My path was to take the medications in the beginning and do what was needed
to get off them.
mostly for me that was getting off my butt and out of the house more often.
If I didn't choose the meds at first perhaps I would have been motivated to
do even more to help
keep my numbers in line. there is no one size fits all i diet or treatment
that is why Kurt and myself
speak up so much about other people telling newbie's what numbers to shoot
for.
some will do great shooting for normal numbers as a newbie others will do
better taking their time
making sure each A1C is lower then the next and then go after tighter
control with a healthier body.


--
Tom

www.TomsDiabeticDiary.com

Chat in peace with other diabetes at the American Diabetes Associations Web
Site.
http://community.diabetes.org/n/pfx/...esz&redirCnt=1

Information You Can "Trust" From Your American Diabetes Association
www.diabetes.org

Information on Specific Types of Fat.
http://www.diabetes.org/nutrition-an...cific-fats.jsp

In article <1194278338.997476.109560@t8g2000prg.googlegroups. com>,
Larry <boelkowj@aol.com> wrote:

> On Nov 5, 6:39?am, "W. Baker" <wba...@panix.com> wrote:
> > Helen Back <SiriusC...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> > : Hi lovely people!
> >
> > : I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
> > : appear
> > : to be given Metformin automatically.
> >
> > : Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
> > : August?
> >
> > : If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
> > : reasons
> > : for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
> > : diabetic
> > : (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
> > : LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
> > : pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
> > : appointment.
> >
> > : I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
> > : under 6
> > : (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost
> > : over
> > : 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may
> > : be
> > : that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
> > : newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
> >
> > : I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
> >
> > : Thanks.
> >
> > Many doctors I know like to try diet and exercise first if they think they
> > have a cooperative patient. If that doesn't work, then metformin is
> > usually the first drug to be tried. It lookslike your weird diagnosis may
> > well leve you able to control on diet and exercise(D&E) alone! That woudl
> > be gret too. Wy take more meds than you need?
> >
> > Wendy

Larry,

I'm not sure why you didn't put your comments on my post, but to each
their own, and I'll reply here.

> Priscilla: Primary indication per package insert for metformin is
> better control of blood glucose levels.

That's nice, but I don't try to conform reality to package inserts. I
try to learn more about the meds I take than what has been chewed over
and approved by the legal departments of big pharma to put into print.

> Improved IR helps this process
> in diabetics, and as a result may have protective effects on
> cardiovascular system in some individuals at risk. Comorbidities also
> factor into these risks. I don't think metformin is recommended to be
> used by non diabetic obese individuals for cardiovascular protective
> reasons per the FDA.

I don't know why you add this, since I never suggested prescribing
metformin to someone who doesn't have insulin resistance. It is,
however, more and more prescribed usefully to people with metabolic
syndrome and PCOS, if the clinician is up to date with current practice.
I'm not sure why you bring in the FDA, either. They are no longer a
useful scientific authority and have become a political organization and
corporate support institution, unfortunately.

Priscilla

I was originally put on Prandin which did nothing for me. When I went
to an endo he put me on metformin and then amaryl. Now I am on byetta
and take very little amaryl.

Loretta

"Uncle Enrico" <uncle@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:EZHXi.63381$Um6.62579@newssvr12.news.prodigy. net...
> Helen Back wrote:
>
> > I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people,
they appear
> > to be given Metformin automatically.
> >
> > Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at
diagnosis in
> > August?
>
> My doc first put me on Glipizide without Metformin. When I attended a
> support group meeting and listened to a respected Endocrinologist, she
> told our group that Metformin was the accepted first line of
medication
> among her profession, followed by a sulfonylurea like Glipizide if
> necessary. I talked to my doctor following this info and she put me on
> Metformin.
>
> Another well known doctor, Dr. Richard K. Bernstein, advises Type IIs
to
> go with Metformin followed by insulin, as early as possible, if
necessary.
>
> There are many new therapies available now that were not on the market
> when this history of mine occurred.
>
> Many doctors believe that the best road is diet and exercise if you
can
> achieve good numbers without meds.
>
> Also, Metformin presents the problem of lactic acidosis for the very
> elderly and those with kidney and liver problems or congestive heart
> failure.
>
> Also, Metformin affects the gastrointestinal tract for many and must
be
> introduced gradually.
>
> You should read what Dr. Bernstein has to say about achieving "near
> normal numbers." He's the strictist of physicians who believes that
> tight control including tight carb restriction is best in the long
run.
>
> I prefer strict to loose, personally.
>
>
> Type II since 5/98
> Metformin and Insulin
> Diet of green veggies, nuts and lean proteins
> Daily exercise-walking, weights, cycling
> Last A1C 5.1



i was on metformin and then they added glyburide ,
but that made me drop too low too often ,
so now i'm just on metformin ,
i never thought about why before ,
i just assumed it was the best med for me at the time
>

In alt.support.diabetes on Mon, 5 Nov 2007 12:56:59 -0500 in Msg.#
<15391-472F596B-976@storefull-3237.bay.webtv.net>, sassybklynlady@webtv.net
(Loretta Eisenberg) wrote:

> I was originally put on Prandin which did nothing for me. When I went
> to an endo he put me on metformin and then amaryl. Now I am on byetta
> and take very little amaryl.

I see this post, Loretta.

--
DonnaB shallotpeel, T2 since June 06, USA, last HbA1c 5.3

"Cheers to a new year and another chance for us to get it right." - Oprah
Winfrey (1954-), O Magazine

Loretta Eisenberg <sassybklynlady@webtv.net> wrote:
: I was originally put on Prandin which did nothing for me. When I went
: to an endo he put me on metformin and then amaryl. Now I am on byetta
: and take very little amaryl.

: Loretta
Welcome back Loretta! Good to see you osting agian. Yu were missed.

Wendy

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 11:49:20 GMT, "Helen Back"
<SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:

>Hi lovely people!
>
>I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
>to be given Metformin automatically.
>
>Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
>August?
>
>If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about reasons
>for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true* diabetic
>(she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
>LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
>pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
>appointment.
>
>I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to under 6
>(108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost over
>28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may be
>that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
>newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>
>I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>
>Thanks.
>
I tend to agree with the other comments on the quality of
your medical care. Enough said there.

On metformin there are several schools of thought. A past
poster here, Old Al, promoted it at every opportunity for
type 2 as both helpful for BG's and heart protective. He was
well-informed and his past posts are well worth reading if
you google for them.
http://tinyurl.com/3bc6av

There is also a recent study suggesting other benefits as
cancer-protective; but that's a very early report and needs
further study.

However, I resisted it's use for my first three years after
diagnosis because I wished to try diet and exercise alone.
My logic was, and is, that the meds should be an aid, not a
crutch, and I should attempt to get my body into the best
condition I could to fight the diabetes before I add
medications. I did that successfully, but eventually
progression led to my A1c and FBG rising above thresholds I
had set for myself and I started on Metformin a couple of
years ago. As to why that progression continued I surmise
that it is related to at least five years of uncontrolled
diabetes before diagnosis. I can only guess at how much
damage I did in that time and how much beta cell loss
occurred. However, despite the gradual worsening of my
numbers at that time, I still have no symptoms of any
complications. The metformin did bring things back into
line.

One consequence of that is that I had none of the usual side
effects when I introduced the metformin. Another is that I
believe I am fitter and healthier as a result of that period
of intensive effort to change from a flabby obese 55yo to my
present situation without the support of medications. I'm
definitely no athlete, but I'm also definitely a different
person now.

Bottom line is that it's up to you and your medical
advisors. A second opinion is useful if your current ones
don't fill you with confidence.

Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
d&e, metformin 1500mg, ezetrol 10mg
Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.
--
http://loraldiabetes.blogspot.com
Psyllium, Fibre, Muesli and Nuts

Thanks a lot Wendy. It wasnt by my choice, webtv was going nuts and I
was away.

Loretta

Thanks Donna

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 11:49:20 GMT, "Helen Back"
<SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:

>Hi lovely people!
>
>I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
>to be given Metformin automatically.
>
>Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
>August?

Took about 6 months from my dx before anyone noticed I wasn't on the
stuff - and I'd gotten down to a sub-6 A1c too. I took it when
offered, and was glad I did, because I'm sure it cured an incipient
fatty liver problem; it's now really rare for me to get DP or a big
liver dump. Glad I'm off it now, though!

Nicky.
T2 dx 05/04 + underactive thyroid
D&E, 100ug thyroxine
Last A1c 5.6% BMI 25

In article <4rDXi.20757$FQ2.17433@newsfe4-win.ntli.net>,
"Helen Back" <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:

> Hi lovely people!
>
> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they appear
> to be given Metformin automatically.
>
> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
> August?
>
> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about reasons
> for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true* diabetic
> (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
> LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
> pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
> appointment.
>
> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to under 6
> (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost over
> 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may be
> that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
> newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>
> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!

I've noticed two competing philosophies. The first is that you start
people with diet and exercise, to make those part of the routine. Then,
if you can't control with that, meds are added. The second is that it's
important to bash the bg down relatively quickly, so you start with meds
and then, once you get control consider decreasing or eliminating the
meds. When I was diagnosed, about 10 years ago, meds weren't even
discussed. I suspect my GP would be quicker with the metformin these
days.

--
"[xxx] has very definite opinions, and does not suffer fools lightly.
This, apparently, upsets the fools."
---BB cuts to the pith of a flame-fest

"W. Baker" <wbaker@panix.com> wrote in message
news:fgn9u9$45l$2@reader1.panix.com...
> Helen Back <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
> : Hi lovely people!
>
> : I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
> appear
> : to be given Metformin automatically.
>
> : Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
> : August?
>
> : If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
> reasons
> : for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
> diabetic
> : (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later
> is
> : LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
> : pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
> : appointment.
>
> : I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
> under 6
> : (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost
> over
> : 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may
> be
> : that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
> : newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>
> : I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>
> : Thanks.
>
>
> Many doctors I know like to try diet and exercise first if they think they
> have a cooperative patient. If that doesn't work, then metformin is
> usually the first drug to be tried. It lookslike your weird diagnosis may
> well leve you able to control on diet and exercise(D&E) alone! That woudl
> be gret too. Wy take more meds than you need?
>
> Wendy
>
I stopped taking the Actos, which I'd been on for a year, a few weeks ago. I
don't see any difference in my bgs. Then again, it was supposed to be
beneficial for me, heart wise. If I have a heart attack and die, I'll let
you know.

John

"Alice Faber" <afaber@panix.com> wrote in message
news:afaber-5EE4FB.18572705112007@reader1.panix.com...
> In article <4rDXi.20757$FQ2.17433@newsfe4-win.ntli.net>,
> "Helen Back" <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Hi lovely people!
>>
>> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
>> appear
>> to be given Metformin automatically.
>>
>> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
>> August?
>>
>> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
>> reasons
>> for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
>> diabetic
>> (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
>> LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
>> pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
>> appointment.
>>
>> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
>> under 6
>> (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost
>> over
>> 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may
>> be
>> that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
>> newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>>
>> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>
> I've noticed two competing philosophies. The first is that you start
> people with diet and exercise, to make those part of the routine. Then,
> if you can't control with that, meds are added. The second is that it's
> important to bash the bg down relatively quickly, so you start with meds
> and then, once you get control consider decreasing or eliminating the
> meds. When I was diagnosed, about 10 years ago, meds weren't even
> discussed. I suspect my GP would be quicker with the metformin these
> days.
>
Until I, personally, was diagnosed, I wasn't really "aware" of diabetes even
though I knew people who had it. Now that the awareness it there, I find,
much to my surprise, that those I already knew, and people I am meeting that
are diabetic, are not taking it seriously..... none of them. All make no
more than token sacrifices in their diet. One, that I know, depends entirely
on insulin with no thought to diet at all. I imagine doctors see this all
the time so it's no wonder most of them throw meds at it right away.

John

On Tue, 06 Nov 2007 03:23:13 GMT, johnniemccoy@ posted:

>
>"Alice Faber" <afaber@panix.com> wrote in message
>news:afaber-5EE4FB.18572705112007@reader1.panix.com...
>> In article <4rDXi.20757$FQ2.17433@newsfe4-win.ntli.net>,
>> "Helen Back" <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi lovely people!
>>>
>>> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
>>> appear
>>> to be given Metformin automatically.
>>>
>>> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
>>> August?
>>>
>>> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
>>> reasons
>>> for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
>>> diabetic
>>> (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
>>> LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
>>> pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
>>> appointment.
>>>
>>> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
>>> under 6
>>> (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost
>>> over
>>> 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may
>>> be
>>> that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
>>> newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>>>
>>> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>>
>> I've noticed two competing philosophies. The first is that you start
>> people with diet and exercise, to make those part of the routine. Then,
>> if you can't control with that, meds are added. The second is that it's
>> important to bash the bg down relatively quickly, so you start with meds
>> and then, once you get control consider decreasing or eliminating the
>> meds. When I was diagnosed, about 10 years ago, meds weren't even
>> discussed. I suspect my GP would be quicker with the metformin these
>> days.
>>
>Until I, personally, was diagnosed, I wasn't really "aware" of diabetes even
>though I knew people who had it. Now that the awareness it there, I find,
>much to my surprise, that those I already knew, and people I am meeting that
>are diabetic, are not taking it seriously..... none of them. All make no
>more than token sacrifices in their diet. One, that I know, depends entirely
>on insulin with no thought to diet at all. I imagine doctors see this all
>the time so it's no wonder most of them throw meds at it right away.

A fellow I do contract work for, recently asked me how my health was.
I told him I was diagnosed as having diabetes. He replied, "All old
folks get that. My parents are both diabetic and still eat crap."

--
Larry, T2, Saskatchewan, Canada.
DX 24 Aug 07. D&E
Metformin 2000mg, Ramipril, Simvastatin
Last A1c 8.1 (at DX)

"johnniemccoy@" <johnniemccoy@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote in message
news:xNQXi.6585$Zz.5981@trnddc07...
>
> "W. Baker" <wbaker@panix.com> wrote in message
> news:fgn9u9$45l$2@reader1.panix.com...
>> Helen Back <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>> : Hi lovely people!
>>
>> : I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
>> appear
>> : to be given Metformin automatically.
>>
>> : Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis
>> in
>> : August?
>>
>> : If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
>> reasons
>> : for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
>> diabetic
>> : (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later
>> is
>> : LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
>> : pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
>> : appointment.
>>
>> : I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
>> under 6
>> : (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost
>> over
>> : 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may
>> be
>> : that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as
>> most
>> : newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>>
>> : I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>>
>> : Thanks.
>>
>>
>> Many doctors I know like to try diet and exercise first if they think
>> they
>> have a cooperative patient. If that doesn't work, then metformin is
>> usually the first drug to be tried. It lookslike your weird diagnosis
>> may
>> well leve you able to control on diet and exercise(D&E) alone! That
>> woudl
>> be gret too. Wy take more meds than you need?
>>
>> Wendy
>>
> I stopped taking the Actos, which I'd been on for a year, a few weeks ago.
> I don't see any difference in my bgs. Then again, it was supposed to be
> beneficial for me, heart wise. If I have a heart attack and die, I'll let
> you know.
>
> John

Okay..... it's a deal!! :P

"Uncle Enrico" <uncle@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:EZHXi.63381$Um6.62579@newssvr12.news.prodigy. net...
> Another well known doctor, Dr. Richard K. Bernstein, advises Type IIs to
> go with Metformin followed by insulin, as early as possible, if necessary.

I take it, "...if necessary..." means for those not being proactive enough
with their dx or simply cant control the bg highs and lows for other medical
reasons?

> Many doctors believe that the best road is diet and exercise if you can
> achieve good numbers without meds.

That is the one thing my doctor said on the day of my diagnosis (before she
threw me on the mercy of the non-informative *diabetic* nurse!). She
actually told me that "out of the 80 odd patients I (she) diagnosed with
diabetes in the last couple of years, 2 of them have not needed meds or
insulin later on due to being pro-active - make yourself my third, please!"

>
> Also, Metformin presents the problem of lactic acidosis for the very
> elderly and those with kidney and liver problems or congestive heart
> failure.
>
> Also, Metformin affects the gastrointestinal tract for many and must be
> introduced gradually.

With those downsides - perhaps I shouldnt be wondering why I wasnt given
Metformin straightaway!!

>
> You should read what Dr. Bernstein has to say about achieving "near normal
> numbers." He's the strictist of physicians who believes that tight
> control including tight carb restriction is best in the long run.
>
> I prefer strict to loose, personally.

Me too!

>
>
> Type II since 5/98
> Metformin and Insulin
> Diet of green veggies, nuts and lean proteins
> Daily exercise-walking, weights, cycling
> Last A1C 5.1

Brilliant A1C, btw!! )))

>

"Gantlet" <Tom@TomsDiabeticDiary.com> wrote in message
news:NNIXi.3133$4I.1846@trndny03...
>
> "Helen Back" <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:4rDXi.20757$FQ2.17433@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
>> Hi lovely people!
>>
>> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
>> appear to be given Metformin automatically.
>>
>> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
>> August?
>>
>> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
>> reasons for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
>> diabetic (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out
>> later is LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put
>> too much pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at
>> another appointment.
>>
>> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
>> under 6 (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!),
>> Ive lost over 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have
>> improved - so it may be that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just
>> wondering why, as most newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even
>> offered it.
>>
>> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>>
>> Thanks.
>
> I have no comment on if your doctor is right or wrong.
> we are all different and will not always do good on a path where someone
> else is doing perfectly.
> My path was to take the medications in the beginning and do what was
> needed to get off them.
> mostly for me that was getting off my butt and out of the house more
> often.
> If I didn't choose the meds at first perhaps I would have been motivated
> to do even more to help
> keep my numbers in line. there is no one size fits all i diet or
> treatment that is why Kurt and myself
> speak up so much about other people telling newbie's what numbers to shoot
> for.
> some will do great shooting for normal numbers as a newbie others will do
> better taking their time
> making sure each A1C is lower then the next and then go after tighter
> control with a healthier body.
>

I think, at the end of the day, the advice from all of you is good advice.
You all have a myriad of different recommendations and suggestions - not
only through your own personal dx and experimentation, but through research.

If one of us newly diagnosed only uses a fraction of the advice, we are on a
road of potentially, long-term and positive results.

To be told and encouraged to believe in oneself as the main component in
staying healthy has been the main message through most, if not all, the
responses I was sent.

And although I am the person controlling my dx - it has still been down to
all of you to light the way, so to speak!

Thank you.

Thanks for your input Alice )

"Alice Faber" <afaber@panix.com> wrote in message
news:afaber-5EE4FB.18572705112007@reader1.panix.com...
> In article <4rDXi.20757$FQ2.17433@newsfe4-win.ntli.net>,
> "Helen Back" <SiriusC-63@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Hi lovely people!
>>
>> I ahve noticed that most posts I read on newly diagnosed people, they
>> appear
>> to be given Metformin automatically.
>>
>> Can any of you explain to me why I wasnt given Metformin at diagnosis in
>> August?
>>
>> If you recall, my diabetic nurse gave me contradicting stories about
>> reasons
>> for not taking Metformin. First it was, "you may not be a *true*
>> diabetic
>> (she meant I may have a variation of diabetes -which I found out later is
>> LADA) and if you have to go on insulin, the Metformin will put too much
>> pressure on your liver". She then changed it to pancreas at another
>> appointment.
>>
>> I appear to be controlling my bg very well since diagnosis - down to
>> under 6
>> (108) after most meals (that treadmill has helped IMMENSELY!), Ive lost
>> over
>> 28lbs in weight and am assuming my trigs will have improved - so it may
>> be
>> that Metformin isnt needed anyway. But I am just wondering why, as most
>> newly dx people are given it, that I wasnt even offered it.
>>
>> I'm assuming that most newly dx people are given it, of course!!!!
>
> I've noticed two competing philosophies. The first is that you start
> people with diet and exercise, to make those part of the routine. Then,
> if you can't control with that, meds are added. The second is that it's
> important to bash the bg down relatively quickly, so you start with meds
> and then, once you get control consider decreasing or eliminating the
> meds. When I was diagnosed, about 10 years ago, meds weren't even
> discussed. I suspect my GP would be quicker with the metformin these
> days.
>
> --
> "[xxx] has very definite opinions, and does not suffer fools lightly.
> This, apparently, upsets the fools."
> ---BB cuts to the pith of a flame-fest

"johnniemccoy@" <johnniemccoy@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote in message
news:B6RXi.9183$h17.8878@trnddc04...
>>
> Until I, personally, was diagnosed, I wasn't really "aware" of diabetes
> even though I knew people who had it. Now that the awareness it there, I
> find, much to my surprise, that those I already knew, and people I am
> meeting that are diabetic, are not taking it seriously..... none of them.
> All make no more than token sacrifices in their diet. One, that I know,
> depends entirely on insulin with no thought to diet at all. I imagine
> doctors see this all the time so it's no wonder most of them throw meds at
> it right away.
>
> John
I'm aware of a few people who are diabetic and are also not of the curious
kind. They accept that they have diabetes but, either through ignorance or
non-information from their doctors, they are eating and drinking as they
have always done. Okay, they may have stopped eating grapes, after being
told not to!! - but thats about it!

Who is to blame, really?

As soon as I was diagnosed I went googling. And scared the **** out of
myself. Then, in my fear, I went looking for support and ended up here.

This group has guided me and, in that guidance, I realised that my diabetic
nurse is not truly clued up on the do's and dont's of diabetes. She follows
the Diabetes UK textbook way and frowned upon my choice to check everything
that passes into my gut (huffed and tutted under her breath when she checked
my food diary).

Obviously, there are others who have not had the inclination to go searching
for more info and support - they simply take the information handed out by
said diabetic nurses - and are simply none the wiser in realising how
*chronic* diabetes is if left uncontrolled.

Again, who is to blame? The so called professionals or people who arent
curious enough to find out more about their dx?