<!-- google_ad_section_start -->the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
Health Forums

Go Back   Health Forums > Mental Health > Schizophrenia > alt.support.schizophrenia

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-26-2007, 05:33 PM
small giant
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy

The Holy Qur’an Affirms the Oneness of God
The Islamic concept of God is crystal clear, and it is purely of
divine source ¾ not human conjecture. Man, with all his senses, sees
God’s creation around him ¾ both animate and inanimate objects.
These include the heavens and the earth, and all between them ¾
mankind, the sun, the moon, the stars, the rain, the mountains,
animals, vegetables and all kinds of fruits, and many more. All these
have the same patterns of creation, and are, therefore, clear signs
that there is One and only True God, Allah I the Almighty and the
Supreme Creator. He has asked us to meditate on those signs, so we
would be able to realize that every creation has a definite purpose
¾ not accidental nor a mere idle sport. Allah I says: “Not for (idle
sports did We create the heavens and the earth and all that is
between!” (Qur’an 21:16) Elsewhere in the Qur’an, Allah the Almighty
likewise says:

“We created not the heavens, the earth, and all between them, but for
just ends.... For verily it is your Rabb (Sustainer) Who is the Master
¾ Creator knowing all things.” (Qur’an 15:85-85)

“Your God is one God: as to those who believe not in the Hereafter,
their hearts refuse to know, and they are arrogant.” (Qur’an 16:22)

In order to satisfy further those with inquisitive minds, they should
ponder over the following explicit accounts of the Oneness of God, as
stated in the Holy Qur’an:

“And your God is One God: there is no god but He, Most Gracious, Most
Merciful.” (Qur’an 2:163)

“Allah, there is no god but He, ¾ the Living the Self- subsisting
Eternal. No slumber can seize Him nor sleep. His are all things in the
heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence
except as He permits? He knows what (appears to His creatures as)
before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass aught of His
knowledge except as He wills. His Throne does extend over the heavens
and on earth, and He feels no fatigue in guarding and preserving
them for He is the Most High, the Supreme (in glory).” (Qur’an
2:255)

“Verily, verily, your God is One! ” (Qur’an 37:4)

“Say: ‘He is Allah the One and Only; God, the Eternal, Absolute; He
begets not, nor is He begotten; and there is none like unto
Him.” (Qur’an 112:1-4)

The foregoing verses are just some of the numerous Qur’anic
injunctions, which clearly manifest the Oneness of God. But to rectify
man’s baseless conjectures, Allah the Almighty Himself explicitly
brands those who adhere to Trinity and other strange polytheistic
beliefs as blasphemers, as manifested in the following verse:

“They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for
there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of
blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers
among them.” (Qur’an 5:74)

Allah: The One and Only True God Devoid of Any Partner
The One and Only true God, Allah, has absolutely no partner. Indeed,
He is selfÜsufficient. He does not need any associate. So, one should
not venture into believing that God shares His divinity with anyone.
Indeed, this is a blasphemous belief, which will only pave the way
(for someone who cherishes it) to Hell-Fire. The following Qur’anic
verses elucidate the nature of Allah I, being the One and Only True
God, Who is absolutely devoid of any partner:

“Allah is He, beside Whom there is no other god; Who knows (all
things) both secret and open; He Most Gracious, Most Merciful. Allah
is He, beside Whom there is no other god; the Sovereign, the Holy One,
the Source of Peace (and Perfection), the Guardian of Faith, the
Preserver of Safety, the Exalted in Might, the Irresistible, the
Supreme: Glory to Allah! (High is He) above the partners they
attribute to Him. He is Allah, the Creator, the Originator, and the
Fashioner. To Him belong the Most Beautiful Names. Whatever is in
the heavens and on earth, does declare His Praises and Glory and He is
the Exalted in Might, the Wise.” (Qur’an 59:22-24)

“One day shall We gather them altogether: We shall say to those who
ascribed partners (to us): ‘Where are the partners whom ye (in vented
and) talked about ?’ There will then be (left) no excuse for them but
to say: ‘By Allah our Rabb we were not those who joined gods with
Allah. Behold! How they lie against themselves but the (lie) which
they invented will leave them in the lurch. ” (Qur’an 6:22-24)

“He knows what is hidden and what is open: too high is He for the
partners they attribute to Him!” (Qur’an 23:92)

Any rational human being who sincerely acknowledges the unique
attributes of Allah I, which are absolutely Divine and true to Himself
alone, will never associate anything with Him. Allah I, the one and
only true God, is the sole Living God of the Universe. He is Eternal,
Absolute, Most Compassionate, Most Gracious, Omnipresent, Omniscient,
Omnipotent, Most Powerful and SelfÜ Sufficient. He is the Giver of
Life, the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth, and all between them.
He is the best Disposer of Affairs. He is Most High, Great. He is Most
Forbearing and the Best of Planners. He is quick in retribution, but
forgiving and merciful. He is Exalted in power, Wise, free of all
wants and worthy of all praise.

He is the Rabb (Sustainer) of the Throne of Honor. To Him belong the
End and the Beginning. He is above time and space; hence, no vision
can ever grasp Him.

Allah Rectifies the Christians’ Misconception Concerning the Alleged
Divinity of Jesus
The Christian concept of God includes Jesus Christ as one of three in
a Trinity. This is obviously a sort of misconception, which is based
on their allegation that Jesus is the “Only Begotten Son of God”.
Being All-Knowing, All-Perfect and devoid of all the animalistic
qualities the Christians attribute to Him, Allah I categorically
rectifies such misconception as the following verses show:

“They say, ‘God has begotten a son.’ Glory be to Him! He is selfÜ
sufficient. His are all things in the heavens and on earth! No
warrant have you to say this. Say you about Allah what you know
not?” (Qur’an 10:68)

“It is not befitting to (the majesty) of Allah that He should beget a
son. Glory be to Him! When He determines a matter He only says to it
‘Be, and it is.’” (Qur’an 19:35)

“They say: ‘(God) Most Gracious has begotten a son!’ Indeed you have
put forth a thing most monstrous! At it the skies are ready to burst
the earth to split asunder and the mountains to fall down in utter
ruin, that they should invoke a son for (Allah) Most Gracious. For it
is not consonant with the majesty of (Allah) Most Gracious that He
should beget a son.” (Qur’an 19:88-92)

“No son did Allah beget, nor is there any god along with Him: (if
there were many gods), behold! Each god would have taken away what he
had created and some would have lorded it over others. (He is free)
from the (son of) things they attribute to Him.” (Qur’an 23: 91)

“Did He (then) choose daughters rather than sons?" (Qur’an 37: 153)

The misconception that Jesus (allegedly being the “Only Begotten Son”)
has the same divine essence as the Supreme Creator is, indeed, a great
unforgivable sin. Every Christian must know that Jesus was a man; and
as such, he does not possess any of the divine attributes of Allah. In
fact, the Bible testifies that “God is not a man”. With this alone,
the Christians are either ignorant of their own scriptures or they are
merely blindÜfollowers of a false god. After all, their Bible tells
them more than once that Jesus was a man.

By the same token, the Bible mentions the weaknesses of Jesus. Just
like any other man, Jesus felt the basic human needs of hunger and
thirst. By the same token, like anyone who needs to rest when the day
is gone, Jesus also slept. The case of Allah is entirely different as
“No slumber can seize Him nor sleep” and “there is nothing whatsoever
like unto Him...” (Qur’an 42:11) Thus, the Christian concept of the
deity of Jesus is absolutely contrary to the Divine Oneness of Allah
I. The Holy Qur’an states:

“They do blaspheme who say: ‘God is Christ the son of Mary.’ But said
Christ: ‘O Children of Israel.’ worship God, my Rabb (Sustainer) and
your Rabb (Sustainer).’ Whoever joins other gods with God, Allah
will forbid him the Garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There
will for the wrong doers be no one to help.” (Qur’an 5:73)

“Allah has said: ‘Take not (for worship ) two gods: for He is just One
God: then fear Me (and Me alone ).” (Qur’an 16:51)

The Christian doctrine that Jesus had to die on the cross (because
nothing in this world is holier than his blood to atone for the sins
committed by the entire human race) is so obscure. It is absolutely
unthinkable, for instance, that those of the previous generations who
received and followed the divine messages through the chain of former
prophets (Noah, Abraham, Moses and the like) could not attain
salvation simply because they did not affirm Jesus Christ as their
savior. Thus, accepting this misconception would be against all laws
ever known to man, let alone the Divine Law of Allah.

Allah the Almighty is AllÜKnowing, and for sure He is fully aware of
how the Christian Church imposed their own fabricated dogmas (like the
divinity of Jesus and blood atonement) on peoples worldwide. Such
dogmas were not at all taught by any of the prophets, including Jesus
and Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon them all). In
refuting the Christian concept of salvation (thru Jesus Christ), Allah
the Almighty explicitly emphasizes that one’s own sin is his sole
responsibility, and should not be borne by another. The Holy Qur’an
states:

“Say: ‘Shall I seek for (my) Cherisher other than Allah, when He is
the Cherisher of all things (that exist)? Every soul draws the need of
its acts on none but itself. No bearer of burdens call bear the
burden of another. Your goal in the end is towards God: He will tell
you the truth of the things wherein you disputed.” (Qur’an 6:164)

Belief in One God: The Key to Salvation
For one to attain salvation (that is, for him to be saved from the
torment of Hell-Fire), he has to firmly believe that there is no god
but the One and Only True God (Allah). Prophet Muhammad r says:

“The key to Paradise is the testimony to the fact that there is no god
but Allah.” (Muslim)

“He who died knowing (and acknowledging it ) that there is no god but
Allah, he is in fact entitled to get into Paradise.” (Muslim)

By the same token, any person who deviates from the belief in Allah
(the One and Only True God) will have Hell-Fire as his ultimate abode,
as evidenced in the following saying of Prophet Muhammad r:

“Two things yield inevitable results.” A person said: “Allah’s
Messenger, what these two things are?” He r said: “He who died
associating anything with Allah would definitely enter into Hell-Fire
and he who died with out associating an anything with Allah he in fact
entitled himself to go into Paradise.” (Muslim)

The foregoing Hadith conforms to Allah’s saying that He forgives sins
other than that of associating other gods with Him, as the following
Qur’anic verse manifests:

“ ... Allâh forgives not that partners should be set up with him;
but He forgives anything else, to whom He pleases; to set up
partners with Allâh is to devise a sin most heinous indeed.” (Qur’an
4:47- 48)

For anyone to strengthen his faith and attain salvation, he should,
therefore, contemplate the foregoing verse. He should always bear in
mind that, being the Wisest of Judges, “Allah is never unjust in the
least degree...” Furthermore, the following verses, reflecting Allah’s
justice, should inspire every man to seek salvation through complete
faith in Him, instead of irrationally seeking salvation through blood
atonement.

“Whoever works righteousness, man or woman, and has faith, verily, to
him will We give a new Life, a life that is good and pure, and We
will bestow on such their reward according to the best of their
actions.”

“He that works evil will riot be requited but by the like thereof:
and he that works a righteous deed ¾ whether man or woman and is a
believer ¾ such will enter the Garden (of Bliss ): therein will they
have abundance without measure.” (Qur’an 40:40)

“That man can have nothing but what he strives for.” (Qur’an 53:39)

“Then shall anyone who has done an atom’s weight of good, see it! And
shall anyone who has done an atom’s weight of evil, shall see
it.” (Qur’an 99:7-8)

Thus, complete faith in Allah (the One and Only True God) is essential
for one’s own salvation. Faith becomes meaningful only when it is
translated into practice. So, fortunate is he whose belief and deeds
are always meant for pleasing Allah alone.

Summary and Concluding Remarks

This book has shown historical facts surrounding the Trinitarian
controversy. It has shown that the Trinitarian doctrine was ratified
only in the fourth century, proving that Jesus (peace and blessings of
Allah be upon him) was not its own author. Christendom has for
centuries been in disarray, and the real followers of Jesus (peace and
blessings of Allah be upon him) found the Trinitarian doctrine very
strange and abominable. They not only opposed it in words, but many
of them also stood firmly in defense of the Divine Oneness of God, a
doctrine taught by Jesus himself and all other prophets (peace and
blessings of Allah be upon them all). The leaders and members of the
Apostolic church ¾ a group of the real followers of Jesus (peace and
blessings of Allah be upon him) ¾ died in thousands as a result of
persecution against them by the Romans in collaboration with those of
the Pauline church. The Unitarian Christians preferred to die for a
noble cause (i.e., in their great attempt to defend their monotheistic
belief) rather than accept the mysterious doctrine of Trinity.



The Trinitarian school of thought dominated the Christian world only
after the Pauline church imposed it by force on those who neither
understood it nor sincerely accepted it as a divine precept. Such
coercion was strongly condemned and resisted by those who believed
that Jesus was a mere prophet of God, and not one of three in a
Trinity. Politics, however, played a very significant role in selling
the idea of Triune God to the Christian masses. In fact, it took
Christendom more than three hundred years to ratify the Trinitarian
doctrine. But even after ratification, the Unitarian Christians
continued to defy it. Imposition of the death penalty for those who
opposed the Trinitarian system had ultimately given it a clear
commanding edge over the pristine tenets of the Apostolic church.

The book has likewise examined some if the controversial personalities
behind the success of the Trinitarian doctrine. These include
Athanasius, Constantine and Paul. These individuals were as
controversial as the Trinitarian doctrine itself. For instance,
Athanasius was considered by virtue of an imperial decree as a public
enemy who was wanted by the then Emperor Constantius “dead or alive”,
and this happened years after the ratification of the Trinitarian
doctrine. In his attempt to save his life, he resorted to hiding from
one place to another until he discovered a young woman who was known
for her exquisite beauty. Their clandestine affair resulted in an
illicit, adulterous crime by a man who had engineered the Athanasian
creed (the Trinitarian doctrine).

By the same token, Emperor Constantine (who ratified the Doctrine of
Trinity) was himself a tyrant and criminal who thundered his son, his
wife and many more, because of his lust for political power. Neither
did he understand the real theological foundation of Christianity nor
was he himself a real Christian. His crimes, including the murder of
thousands of innocent individuals, coupled with his paganistic belief,
were grievous. Ironically, however, life was made easy for him by the
Christian clergymen. They offered him forgiveness, despite the fact
that only God can forgive those grievous sins! So, in return,
Constantine gave them imperial protection; and, subsequently, he
ratified for them their doctrine of Trinity.

Moreover, the very founder of today’s Christianity (Paul) was himself
very controversial. Christians’ belief that he was a divinely
inspired apostle is so obscure. First of all, Paul (who had never
personally met Jesus) was not among the twelve disciples. Second, he
had persecuted many of the real followers of Jesus. Third, Paul’s
teachings, in general, contradict those of Jesus (peace and blessings
of Allah be upon him). In fact, (large part of the New Testament,
which was ratified by Emperor Constantine during the Nicene Council in
325 A. D., was Paul’s own fabrications. Specifically, Paul’s letters
to the Romans, the Galatians, the Philippians, and the like were his
own making, which do not at all conform to the real teachings of Jesus
(peace and blessings of Allah be upon him). In fact, this book has
shown that virtually all of the Pauline epistles had no reference to
the practical teachings, personal sayings and real personality of
Jesus (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him).

Based on the historical facts presented in this book, Christians only
need to use their objectivity and rational thinking to realize that
the manÜmade Trinity that they have been worshipping all the years is
nothing but a product of political and personal manipulations by such
men as Athanasius, Constantine and Paul. Their criminal backgrounds or
immoralities were enough grounds that they were devoid of any divine
inspiration. It follows, therefore, that the Trinitarian doctrine is
human and not divine in nature.

This booklet has also shown that the mysterious nature of the
controversial Trinity can be solved through the concept of God in
Islam. Several Qur’anic injunctions are presented, which explicitly
refute the Trinitarian doctrine and the divinity of Jesus; affirm the
Oneness of God; stress the fundamental Truth that God is selfÜ
reliant, hence devoid of any partner; and highlight the belief in
Allah (the One and Only True God) as the key to salvation. On the
other hand, joining partners with Allah is the key to Hell-Fire, so He
commands us not to worship anyone other than Him. Indeed, Allah is
selfÜ sufficient; He does not have to share His Divinity with anyone
else. Therefore, Christians who really seek Truth only need to revert
to the belief in the absolute Oneness of God, for them to be able to
avoid the confusion or mystery underlying the Trinitarian doctrine.
After all, Jesus and all other prophets (peace and blessings of Allah
be upon them all) taught the Divine Oneness of God, which is the very
creed of Islam ¾ the peaceful submission to the Will of Allah the
Almighty.

Today, Islam has already surpassed Christianity as the N umber One
religion in the world. This is so, because the real seekers of Truth
found Islam as the only religion that truly advocates the belief in
the absolute Oneness of God. Furthermore, Islam is growing so fast,
because many of those who embraced it as their new faith have played a
very significant role in conveying its message to the rest of
mankind.

Islam considers salvation as a personal responsibility, that is based
on one’s faith , piety, righteousness, steadfastness and noble service
¾ not an object of blood atonement or vicarious sacrifice. It
abolishes idolatry, a practice which is commonplace to all other
religions. It is the only religion in the world that has upheld the
absolute Oneness of God ¾ a divine concept, which in every
respect serves as the ultimate solution to the Trinitarian
controversy.

see this site for more information www.sultan.org


and this is my mobile number 00966566299135
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-26-2007, 06:35 PM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

so then..
You put limits on God and say he could not manifest as a frail human?
Under any circumstances?

Allah, God, is by deffintion beyond our attempt to fully understand.
Correct?

But he couldn't have incarnated his nature in a single human being?

Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-27-2007, 09:00 AM
George Peter Staplin
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy

small giant wrote:
> The Holy Qur?an Affirms the Oneness of God
> He is the Rabb (Sustainer) of the Throne of Honor. To Him belong the
> End and the Beginning. He is above time and space; hence, no vision
> can ever grasp Him.


God is all knowing and all powerful, yet he can't write his own book?

Perhaps God isn't what most people think he/it is?

He also needs multiple prophets, and apparently Mohammed's Quran? After
all of them failed... Yet it seems the Quran has failed too. It has
failed to convert everyone, and bring peace.

[snip]

Proving one fallacy by using it as the antithesis of another fallacy
isn't good.

> Summary and Concluding Remarks


> Allah is
> self? sufficient; He does not have to share His Divinity with anyone
> else. Therefore, Christians who really seek Truth only need to revert
> to the belief in the absolute Oneness of God, for them to be able to
> avoid the confusion or mystery underlying the Trinitarian doctrine.
> After all, Jesus and all other prophets (peace and blessings of Allah
> be upon them all) taught the Divine Oneness of God, which is the very
> creed of Islam ? the peaceful submission to the Will of Allah the
> Almighty.



The submission to the Will of Allah? Why? I was given my will and God
let me do with it as I see fit. Furthermore your ways limit your will,
and replace it with Mohammed's will. God doesn't repress women like
Islamic cultures do, and I'm well aware of women in the cult'ure saying
"I'm not oppressed" on Oprah. I have heard both sides and made up my
mind (for now).

Taking away the temptation isn't a way to reinforce a person, or fix
them. For example not seeing a woman's body parts doesn't take away the
thoughts, or reasons behind those thoughts. Your Burkas are faulty
tools that actually harm souls. Women weren't born with Burkas given to
them by God.

Praying 3 times a day amongst your fellow Islamists doesn't fix any
problems in your self does it? You may have more fear of doing those
wrong acts, but deep in your mind, heart, and soul they linger. Don't
you think with more freedom in heaven for eternity? that you would
eventually stop fearing and sin?

Find the root of the problem, don't treat the symptom.


> Today, Islam has already surpassed Christianity as the N umber One
> religion in the world. This is so, because the real seekers of Truth
> found Islam as the only religion that truly advocates the belief in
> the absolute Oneness of God. Furthermore, Islam is growing so fast,
> because many of those who embraced it as their new faith have played a
> very significant role in conveying its message to the rest of
> mankind.


Well, you probably know the saying about people jumping off of cliffs.

> Islam considers salvation as a personal responsibility, that is based
> on one?s faith , piety, righteousness, steadfastness and noble service
> ? not an object of blood atonement or vicarious sacrifice. It
> abolishes idolatry, a practice which is commonplace to all other
> religions. It is the only religion in the world that has upheld the
> absolute Oneness of God ? a divine concept, which in every
> respect serves as the ultimate solution to the Trinitarian
> controversy.


Uhm, what about Zoroaster's religion? As I recall, it was the first
religion with Ahura Mazda as God.


And to the Christians -- I'm well aware of people like Martin Luther
saying that "Reason is a whore." And I'm doing lots of reasoning -- for
a reason.


George
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-27-2007, 06:02 PM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

They bomb each other's mosques when they gather to worship.
A LOT recently in Pakistan and Iraq especially.

Different Mosques have gun battles between them.

Looking back, maybe the Inquisition wasn't all that bad.

Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-27-2007, 06:02 PM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

Remember when the Pope, speaking to seminaries referenced an historical
dialogue from the time of the Fall of Byzantium which mentioned the
practice of "baptizing by the sword"?

The speech was picked up by the press.

Renounce your faith and accept Islam or die? Baptism by the sword .

Well.....the historical documented discussion, according to Islam. never
happened and they never did that.
Islam is not a violent faith they said, and the pope wrongfully
portrayed it.

So to demonstrate Islam's peaceful nature there was a rash of Church
bombings and they killed a Nun aid worker in Somalia because the Pope
was interpreted as sayng Islam is a violent faith?

INCREDIBLE.....


Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-27-2007, 06:02 PM
Judy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy

On 27 Dec, 17:36, brainsprai...@webtv.net (Deep Thoughts) wrote:
> Remember when the Pope, speaking to seminaries referenced an historical
> dialogue from the time of the Fall of Byzantium which mentioned the
> practice of "baptizing by the sword"?
>
> The speech was picked up by the press.
>
> Renounce your faith and accept Islam or die? Baptism by the sword .
>
> Well.....the historical documented discussion, according to Islam. never
> happened and they never did that.
> Islam is not a violent faith they said, and the pope wrongfully
> portrayed it.
>
> So to demonstrate Islam's peaceful nature there was a rash of Church
> bombings and they killed a Nun aid worker in Somalia because the Pope
> was interpreted as sayng Islam is a violent faith?
>
> INCREDIBLE.....


So dan slipped out through another door and let somebody else in to
take a swipe at Islam,
and then he presumably will creep back in through another door, and
swear blind, truthfully, that he didn't.

and meantime
a whole stink is piling up

and you shove that on her, and you will answer to me.

I am not afraid of where I am or what I've been surreptiously turned
into.
and I am not unable to reach you,
and I know who you all are now



Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-28-2007, 01:06 AM
George Peter Staplin
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy

Judy wrote:
> On 27 Dec, 17:36, brainsprai...@webtv.net (Deep Thoughts) wrote:
>> Remember when the Pope, speaking to seminaries referenced an historical
>> dialogue from the time of the Fall of Byzantium which mentioned the
>> practice of "baptizing by the sword"?
>>
>> The speech was picked up by the press.
>>
>> Renounce your faith and accept Islam or die? Baptism by the sword .
>>
>> Well.....the historical documented discussion, according to Islam. never
>> happened and they never did that.
>> Islam is not a violent faith they said, and the pope wrongfully
>> portrayed it.
>>
>> So to demonstrate Islam's peaceful nature there was a rash of Church
>> bombings and they killed a Nun aid worker in Somalia because the Pope
>> was interpreted as sayng Islam is a violent faith?
>>
>> INCREDIBLE.....

>
> So dan slipped out through another door and let somebody else in to
> take a swipe at Islam,
> and then he presumably will creep back in through another door, and
> swear blind, truthfully, that he didn't.
>
> and meantime
> a whole stink is piling up
>
> and you shove that on her, and you will answer to me.
>
> I am not afraid of where I am or what I've been surreptiously turned
> into.
> and I am not unable to reach you,
> and I know who you all are now



Are you ok Judy? You sound delusional at the moment. What do you mean
by "I know who you all are now?" I'm just George.


George
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-28-2007, 02:00 AM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

I found that the taking over that russian school and killing many of the
kids to be particualarly Islamic as Islam is being demonstrated.

I mean.....maybe the Christians blowing up planned parenthood clinics
(USA) and killing people isn't cool at all either.

I SAW...men locked in fatal combat making allowances for children
running underfoot.
Gooks and americans trying very hard to kill each other in close
quarters in a city.

We both made life sacrificing judgements to protect the children.
I SAW it....
Me and my deadly serious conflict with enemy.

Blow up a bomb in a subway????
Not me, and not my previous enemy.
Its terrible to see honor in the enemy.

Blowing up population centers like subways is not acceptable to my
understanding of civility.

So then.....lets adjust...

THEY explained that THEY respond to bombings of major civilain centers?
Its their culture.

So.......should we speak back in a language they gave us and which they
delared they respond to or not?

WHEN will we accept their challenge and act like in Rome do as the
Romans?(St.Paul)

Its their world view.






Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-28-2007, 02:48 AM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

Christian morality will not allow us to blow up large numbers of Moslems
so they will respond.
Yet they believe, its who they are, that blowing up people at the world
trade center....many of whom were moslems....would make us complant.

GET THE MESSAGE YET!!!!!

Lets teach em about smart bombs and kill some thousands trying to get to
work someday with every assault the extreameists do....

Its plain language!

YES IT WOULD WORK!!!

But we're Christian in nature, the west.
So we won't do the evident answer......yet.

Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-28-2007, 02:48 AM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

I have been to demonstartions recetly to stop the war in Iran.
Yes.
Before Bush ignores the CIA again.
The CIA said Iraq invasion would be counter productive.
Bush doesn't/didn't care.
Facts be damned.
We have to spread democracy.

What.....give aphanistan back to the taliban?
Bad idea for the whole world.

Bush is an asshole? We all know that.

Fight back in kind with indiscrimate mass murder? le shools for
example?

They expect that such behavior would change the western mind (Spain
excluded).
This is their mindset, their belief.

Now.....
Answer this.
What is the answer?
Spread democracy.....yeah...right...

Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-28-2007, 03:01 AM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

I believe that this getting the tide of kids running around out of the
way so we could do the business of killing each other saved my life
once.

I knew my enemy by his face.
I know him still...if he survived.
Him and me, we contested for a long time.
Other men were getting out of the way.
We had battle....him and me.
I wanted him, by name, dead....
Troops moved because of what he and I were doing.

And we were fighting down town around corners and in alleys.
He had a clear shot once and I believe with all my heart he didn't take
it because he knew I got kids out of the way.
Just for that instant....
Then we went back to the manly art of killing.

He didn't take the shot on purpose.
I saw it.
He raised the gun barrel.....

In a real sense, we were on the same side. Don't hurt the kids.

Yes I gave him the shot....for me AND other amrican lives.
The others were mere pawns.
We were locked together.

He wasn't a muslim killing kids in school in Russia.

Yes we went back to trying to kill each other.

I think we both lived......because we were interupted by other guns....

Or was it because we both had values.
Maybe a higher force let us off?
Both good men.....

Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-28-2007, 03:01 AM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

Maybe blowing up commuter buses is legitamate politcal action.

Many arabs believe so according to polls.

But notably in Pakistan with the increase in Mosque bombings, DURING
services.....the percentage had dropped noticably.

Me and my enemy clearly don't believe so....

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-28-2007, 12:32 PM
Miguel Lahunkun
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

1John1:5 says, "God is light". Photons, the measured quanta of
light, is seen to be the energy transferred within atoms. Light is
energy. There is light that travels at light speed, v=c.
That which is called probability is energy that is "the Force"
which travels faster than light, v>c.
The human race messed up so bad that God manifested in knowable
matter, as Jesus Christ, to help us, v<c, but the Son has always been.
Here we have the Trinity. Father creator at v=c, Holy Spirit at
v>c, and the Son at v<c. It's undoubtable.

Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-28-2007, 05:38 PM
Gelly
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy

On Dec 28, 6:15 am, gellie...@webtv.net (Miguel Lahunkun) wrote:
> 1John1:5 says, "God is light". Photons, the measured quanta of
> light, is seen to be the energy transferred within atoms. Light is
> energy. There is light that travels at light speed, v=c.
> That which is called probability is energy that is "the Force"
> which travels faster than light, v>c.
> The human race messed up so bad that God manifested in knowable
> matter, as Jesus Christ, to help us, v<c, but the Son has always been.
> Here we have the Trinity. Father creator at v=c, Holy Spirit at
> v>c, and the Son at v<c. It's undoubtable.


This conversations sounds interesting. I wish I was up to reading all
of these long messages and participating. I am not right now.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-28-2007, 08:40 PM
gypsumbreath@mikikocic.com
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy

On Dec 28, 12:24*pm, Gelly <Gell...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 28, 6:15 am, gellie...@webtv.net (Miguel Lahunkun) wrote:
> This conversations sounds interesting. I wish I was up to reading all
> of these long messages and participating. I am not right now.


There comes a point when you start to talk yourself into feeling worse
than you otherwise would. I'm not saying your problems are imaginary,
just that you keep reinforcing your down mood by saying over and over
again, "I'm down, I'm down, I'm down..." It doesn't bother me to read
or hear you say that, but I'm concerned that the efforts people are
making to help you are bouncing off. You seem to be spiralling into
one of those self-reinforcing cycles that *will* end in death unless
you let people help you fight it.

Miki
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-29-2007, 01:32 AM
Lix Tetrax
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy


It's the fundamentalist christians and the extremist muslims people
have to be wary of it seems.

And Gargamel, Skeletor, Megatron and Santa.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-29-2007, 03:18 PM
Deep Thoughts
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitariancontroversy

Miki,
Its true what you say.
I don't believe its good for me to hear myself saying over and over
something negative.
It does actually build the "bad".
I've seen this repeatedly in myself and keep learning it over and
over...so it seems.

But sometims we just gotta say it and hopefully be recognized as being
legitamate in our troubles.

We hear ourselves when we speak, especially when in front of others.
I try to guard against my own negativity.
Good point, Miki.

You cool Girl. Gelly.

SBK

Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-30-2007, 03:36 AM
gypsumbreath@mikikocic.com
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy

On Dec 26, 12:16 pm, small giant <mutawafa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> The Holy Qur'an Affirms the Oneness of God
> The Islamic concept of God is crystal clear, and it is purely of
> divine source 3/4 not human conjecture. Man, with all his senses, sees
> God's creation around him 3/4 both animate and inanimate objects.
> These include the heavens and the earth, and all between them 3/4
> mankind, the sun, the moon, the stars, the rain, the mountains,
> animals, vegetables and all kinds of fruits, and many more. All these
> have the same patterns of creation, and are, therefore, clear signs
> that there is One and only True God, Allah I the Almighty and the
> Supreme Creator. He has asked us to meditate on those signs, so we
> would be able to realize that every creation has a definite purpose
> 3/4 not accidental nor a mere idle sport. Allah I says: "Not for (idle
> sports did We create the heavens and the earth and all that is
> between!" (Qur'an 21:16) Elsewhere in the Qur'an, Allah the Almighty
> likewise says:
>
> "We created not the heavens, the earth, and all between them, but for
> just ends.... For verily it is your Rabb (Sustainer) Who is the Master
> 3/4 Creator knowing all things." (Qur'an 15:85-85)
>
> "Your God is one God: as to those who believe not in the Hereafter,
> their hearts refuse to know, and they are arrogant." (Qur'an 16:22)
>
> In order to satisfy further those with inquisitive minds, they should
> ponder over the following explicit accounts of the Oneness of God, as
> stated in the Holy Qur'an:
>
> "And your God is One God: there is no god but He, Most Gracious, Most
> Merciful." (Qur'an 2:163)
>
> "Allah, there is no god but He, 3/4 the Living the Self- subsisting
> Eternal. No slumber can seize Him nor sleep. His are all things in the
> heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence
> except as He permits? He knows what (appears to His creatures as)
> before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass aught of His
> knowledge except as He wills. His Throne does extend over the heavens
> and on earth, and He feels no fatigue in guarding and preserving
> them for He is the Most High, the Supreme (in glory)." (Qur'an
> 2:255)
>
> "Verily, verily, your God is One! " (Qur'an 37:4)
>
> "Say: 'He is Allah the One and Only; God, the Eternal, Absolute; He
> begets not, nor is He begotten; and there is none like unto
> Him." (Qur'an 112:1-4)
>
> The foregoing verses are just some of the numerous Qur'anic
> injunctions, which clearly manifest the Oneness of God. But to rectify
> man's baseless conjectures, Allah the Almighty Himself explicitly
> brands those who adhere to Trinity and other strange polytheistic
> beliefs as blasphemers, as manifested in the following verse:
>
> "They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for
> there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of
> blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers
> among them." (Qur'an 5:74)
>
> Allah: The One and Only True God Devoid of Any Partner
> The One and Only true God, Allah, has absolutely no partner. Indeed,
> He is selfÜsufficient. He does not need any associate. So, one should
> not venture into believing that God shares His divinity with anyone.
> Indeed, this is a blasphemous belief, which will only pave the way
> (for someone who cherishes it) to Hell-Fire. The following Qur'anic
> verses elucidate the nature of Allah I, being the One and Only True
> God, Who is absolutely devoid of any partner:
>
> "Allah is He, beside Whom there is no other god; Who knows (all
> things) both secret and open; He Most Gracious, Most Merciful. Allah
> is He, beside Whom there is no other god; the Sovereign, the Holy One,
> the Source of Peace (and Perfection), the Guardian of Faith, the
> Preserver of Safety, the Exalted in Might, the Irresistible, the
> Supreme: Glory to Allah! (High is He) above the partners they
> attribute to Him. He is Allah, the Creator, the Originator, and the
> Fashioner. To Him belong the Most Beautiful Names. Whatever is in
> the heavens and on earth, does declare His Praises and Glory and He is
> the Exalted in Might, the Wise." (Qur'an 59:22-24)
>
> "One day shall We gather them altogether: We shall say to those who
> ascribed partners (to us): 'Where are the partners whom ye (in vented
> and) talked about ?' There will then be (left) no excuse for them but
> to say: 'By Allah our Rabb we were not those who joined gods with
> Allah. Behold! How they lie against themselves but the (lie) which
> they invented will leave them in the lurch. " (Qur'an 6:22-24)
>
> "He knows what is hidden and what is open: too high is He for the
> partners they attribute to Him!" (Qur'an 23:92)
>
> Any rational human being who sincerely acknowledges the unique
> attributes of Allah I, which are absolutely Divine and true to Himself
> alone, will never associate anything with Him. Allah I, the one and
> only true God, is the sole Living God of the Universe. He is Eternal,
> Absolute, Most Compassionate, Most Gracious, Omnipresent, Omniscient,
> Omnipotent, Most Powerful and SelfÜ Sufficient. He is the Giver of
> Life, the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth, and all between them.
> He is the best Disposer of Affairs. He is Most High, Great. He is Most
> Forbearing and the Best of Planners. He is quick in retribution, but
> forgiving and merciful. He is Exalted in power, Wise, free of all
> wants and worthy of all praise.
>
> He is the Rabb (Sustainer) of the Throne of Honor. To Him belong the
> End and the Beginning. He is above time and space; hence, no vision
> can ever grasp Him.
>
> Allah Rectifies the Christians' Misconception Concerning the Alleged
> Divinity of Jesus
> The Christian concept of God includes Jesus Christ as one of three in
> a Trinity. This is obviously a sort of misconception, which is based
> on their allegation that Jesus is the "Only Begotten Son of God".
> Being All-Knowing, All-Perfect and devoid of all the animalistic
> qualities the Christians attribute to Him, Allah I categorically
> rectifies such misconception as the following verses show:
>
> "They say, 'God has begotten a son.' Glory be to Him! He is selfÜ
> sufficient. His are all things in the heavens and on earth! No
> warrant have you to say this. Say you about Allah what you know
> not?" (Qur'an 10:68)
>
> "It is not befitting to (the majesty) of Allah that He should beget a
> son. Glory be to Him! When He determines a matter He only says to it
> 'Be, and it is.'" (Qur'an 19:35)
>
> "They say: '(God) Most Gracious has begotten a son!' Indeed you have
> put forth a thing most monstrous! At it the skies are ready to burst
> the earth to split asunder and the mountains to fall down in utter
> ruin, that they should invoke a son for (Allah) Most Gracious. For it
> is not consonant with the majesty of (Allah) Most Gracious that He
> should beget a son." (Qur'an 19:88-92)
>
> "No son did Allah beget, nor is there any god along with Him: (if
> there were many gods), behold! Each god would have taken away what he
> had created and some would have lorded it over others. (He is free)
> from the (son of) things they attribute to Him." (Qur'an 23: 91)
>
> "Did He (then) choose daughters rather than sons?" (Qur'an 37: 153)
>
> The misconception that Jesus (allegedly being the "Only Begotten Son")
> has the same divine essence as the Supreme Creator is, indeed, a great
> unforgivable sin. Every Christian must know that Jesus was a man; and
> as such, he does not possess any of the divine attributes of Allah. In
> fact, the Bible testifies that "God is not a man". With this alone,
> the Christians are either ignorant of their own scriptures or they are
> merely blindÜfollowers of a false god. After all, their Bible tells
> them more than once that Jesus was a man.
>
> By the same token, the Bible mentions the weaknesses of Jesus. Just
> like any other man, Jesus felt the basic human needs of hunger and
> thirst. By the same token, like anyone who needs to rest when the day
> is gone, Jesus also slept. The case of Allah is entirely different as
> "No slumber can seize Him nor sleep" and "there is nothing whatsoever
> like unto Him..." (Qur'an 42:11) Thus, the Christian concept of the
> deity of Jesus is absolutely contrary to the Divine Oneness of Allah
> I. The Holy Qur'an states:
>
> "They do blaspheme who say: 'God is Christ the son of Mary.' But said
> Christ: 'O Children of Israel.' worship God, my Rabb (Sustainer) and
> your Rabb (Sustainer).' Whoever joins other gods with God, Allah
> will forbid him the Garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There
> will for the wrong doers be no one to help." (Qur'an 5:73)
>
> "Allah has said: 'Take not (for worship ) two gods: for He is just One
> God: then fear Me (and Me alone )." (Qur'an 16:51)
>
> The Christian doctrine that Jesus had to die on the cross (because
> nothing in this world is holier than his blood to atone for the sins
> committed by the entire human race) is so obscure. It is absolutely
> unthinkable, for instance, that those of the previous generations who
> received and followed the divine messages through the chain of former
> prophets (Noah, Abraham, Moses and the like) could not attain
> salvation simply because they did not affirm Jesus Christ as their
> savior. Thus, accepting this misconception would be against all laws
> ever known to man, let alone the Divine Law of Allah.
>
> Allah the Almighty is AllÜKnowing, and for sure He is fully aware of
> how the Christian Church imposed their own fabricated dogmas (like the
> divinity of Jesus and blood atonement) on peoples worldwide. Such
> dogmas were not at all taught by any of the prophets, including Jesus
> and Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon them all). In
> refuting the Christian concept of salvation (thru Jesus Christ), Allah
> the Almighty explicitly emphasizes that one's own sin is his sole
> responsibility, and should not be borne by another. The Holy Qur'an
> states:
>
> "Say: 'Shall I seek for (my) Cherisher other than Allah, when He is
> the Cherisher of all things (that exist)? Every soul ...
>
> read more >>


Does the holy whore-an affirm that you will make jihad on me for
saying that your darling Mohammed now inspires murderous fanatics like
you? Fuck off, you son of a goat.

Miki
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
the oneness of God : the solution to the trinitarian controversy =?windows-1256?B?x8jkIMfhzdHL?= alt.support.diabetes 0 12-26-2007 05:33 PM
GERD Solution. gwadford@gmail.com alt.support.anxiety-panic 0 11-15-2007 08:32 PM
the Enviga controversy, and does green tea really work? determined alt.support.diet 3 02-14-2007 01:22 AM
Aspartame Controversy, in Wikipedia democratic encyclopedia, 72 references (including AspartameNM #1173 by Murray), brief fair summary of much more research: Murray 2007.01.01 Rich Murray alt.support.diabetes 0 01-01-2007 04:48 PM
one solution patrick alt.support.depression 6 11-09-2006 10:29 AM


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.2.0
     
   
 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41