An Arrogant observation

It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class than
regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue collar
people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education level.
I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the streets,
and at work.
The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
people that cannot afford that addiction.

Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am open
to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions

--
AZ

AZ, while one might think you are 'better' since you are now smober,
sadly the rates of smoking tend to be higher in lower socio-economic
groups, at least here in America. So you are right that poorer people
smoke at a higher rate, but it's NOT limited to them by any means.

FlatironMike
FSS & Sociologist
Four months, three weeks, five days, 4 hours, 39 minutes and 12
seconds. 2923 cigarettes not smoked, saving $876.91. Life saved: 1
week, 3 days, 3 hours, 35 minutes.

On Fri, 6 Jul 2007 23:04:17 -0500, "AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
>are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class than
>regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
>nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue collar
>people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education level.
>I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the streets,
>and at work.

I'm sure there are studies on this, but I don't know where they might
be. Several of the ladies that I work with smoke. They're quite
middle class. Two of my children smoke. My son is well educated,
daughter is a restaurant server, but between what she earns and what
her firefighter boyfriend (also a smoker) earns I'm sure they earn
more money than I do (which isn't much), but I suppose they are "blue
collar", but "blue collar" middle class. Mind you, I'm not disputing
what you're saying. You're probably right.

>The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
>people that cannot afford that addiction.
>
>Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am open
>to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions

It always amazes me when my destitute homeless clients come into the
office reeking of smoke. Prior to my quit I couldn't smell it on
them. I don't mind the smell of smoke on people, but with my clients
it's so often not just smoke but BO, dirt, whatnot. That's pretty
disgusting.
Sue
One year, three months, two weeks, two days, 9 hours, 24 minutes and
28 seconds. 15621 cigarettes not smoked, saving $2,601.05. Life saved:
7 weeks, 5 days, 5 hours, 45 minutes.

On Fri, 6 Jul 2007 23:04:17 -0500, "AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
>are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class than
>regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
>nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue collar
>people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education level.
>I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the streets,
>and at work.
>The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
>people that cannot afford that addiction.
>
>Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am open
>to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions

I don't disagree with you at all, AZ. Many times I have to kick
myself in the butt as a reminder that what I'm now "looking down on"
was something I did for 35 years.

As a smoker I used to hate hearing "reformed" smokers talk about
having quit, how much better it was, yada yada yada. I swore that if
I ever did quit I'd never be like that, but since I'd quit only when
they pried the smokes from my cold dead fingers I'd never have to
worry about being "a reformed smoker."

Well, now that I am smober I find myself becoming the bitch that just
can't help telling people how great it is to be a non-smoker. Just
what I used to hate.

I think it's the arrogance that comes with that attitude that makes me
think less of smokers. Even as I type that I feel like a bitch. I
really don't think less of smokers, but, on the other hand....

And yes, there were times as a smoker that I'd buy stink sticks and
THEN figure out what I could afford from the grocery.

Nicotine addiction is nasty shit.


--
BessieBee

"OK, so what's the speed of dark?"
Steven Wright

You guys are a bunch of smug non-smokers, the people you swore you'd
never become.
And *sigh* sadly, that includes me.

Smuggy Ashley

On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 18:21:00 GMT, BessieBee
<BessieBee@I_dont_smoke_anymore.com> wrote:

>On Fri, 6 Jul 2007 23:04:17 -0500, "AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>>It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
>>are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class than
>>regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
>>nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue collar
>>people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education level.
>>I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the streets,
>>and at work.
>>The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
>>people that cannot afford that addiction.
>>
>>Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am open
>>to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions
>
>I don't disagree with you at all, AZ. Many times I have to kick
>myself in the butt as a reminder that what I'm now "looking down on"
>was something I did for 35 years.

I'm not sure that AZ meant looking down on smokers. I think what he
meant was that it seems that the better educated/higher social class
people aren't smoking anymore. Maybe I'm wrong. I sure don't look
down on anyone for smoking.

>
>As a smoker I used to hate hearing "reformed" smokers talk about
>having quit, how much better it was, yada yada yada. I swore that if
>I ever did quit I'd never be like that, but since I'd quit only when
>they pried the smokes from my cold dead fingers I'd never have to
>worry about being "a reformed smoker."
>
>Well, now that I am smober I find myself becoming the bitch that just
>can't help telling people how great it is to be a non-smoker. Just
>what I used to hate.

I would never do that. I'm a bitch but not about anyone's smoking. I
pretty much don't mention it as it's none of my business. Of course,
I make posts here about the benefits and I mention to my GMF every now
and again how glad I am, but he never smoked so I'm not poking at him.

>
>I think it's the arrogance that comes with that attitude that makes me
>think less of smokers.

I have so many failings that it would be hypocritical of me to turn my
nose up at smokers.

> Even as I type that I feel like a bitch. I
>really don't think less of smokers, but, on the other hand....

I'm not in a position to think less of anyone for smoking.

>
>And yes, there were times as a smoker that I'd buy stink sticks and
>THEN figure out what I could afford from the grocery.
>
>Nicotine addiction is nasty shit.

Yes, it is. I don't look down on smokers, I don't feel sorry for
them, I don't want to raise cig taxes or further confine smokers in
any way. That's just me. I haven't forgotten and I despise social
engineering of this type by government.
See? Told ya I'm a bitch.
Sue - stepping down now.

>
>

On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 11:29:39 -0700, writer272002
<writer272002@gmail.com> wrote:

>You guys are a bunch of smug non-smokers, the people you swore you'd
>never become.
>And *sigh* sadly, that includes me.
>
>Smuggy Ashley
>

Not I. Nothing smug about me vis a vis smoking (or much of anything).
The only thing different about me from one year, three months, two
weeks, three days ago is that I don't smoke and thereby I'm healthier
and have more spendable money. None of my attitudes have changed.
None. I've told my smoking kids that if they want to smoke in my
house they're welcome to do so (they don't). I still believe that
smokers are unfairly taxed. If the smokers want to use the bench
right outside the door to my office it's OK with me.
Just me, just my opinions.
Sue
One year, three months, two weeks, two days, 14 hours, 15 minutes and
33 seconds. 15628 cigarettes not smoked, saving $2,602.16. Life saved:
7 weeks, 5 days, 6 hours, 20 minutes.

"BessieBee" <BessieBee@I_dont_smoke_anymore.com> wrote in message
news:jplv835vuidh5kjmpummjnl7vonjccb6h5@4ax.com...
: On Fri, 6 Jul 2007 23:04:17 -0500, "AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote:
:
: >It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
: >are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class
than
: >regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
: >nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue
collar
: >people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education
level.
: >I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the
streets,
: >and at work.
: >The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
: >people that cannot afford that addiction.
: >
: >Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am
open
: >to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions
:
: I don't disagree with you at all, AZ. Many times I have to kick
: myself in the butt as a reminder that what I'm now "looking down on"
: was something I did for 35 years.
:
: As a smoker I used to hate hearing "reformed" smokers talk about
: having quit, how much better it was, yada yada yada. I swore that if
: I ever did quit I'd never be like that, but since I'd quit only when
: they pried the smokes from my cold dead fingers I'd never have to
: worry about being "a reformed smoker."
:
: Well, now that I am smober I find myself becoming the bitch that just
: can't help telling people how great it is to be a non-smoker. Just
: what I used to hate.
:
: I think it's the arrogance that comes with that attitude that makes me
: think less of smokers. Even as I type that I feel like a bitch. I
: really don't think less of smokers, but, on the other hand....
:
: And yes, there were times as a smoker that I'd buy stink sticks and
: THEN figure out what I could afford from the grocery.
:
: Nicotine addiction is nasty shit.
:
:
: --
: BessieBee
:
: "OK, so what's the speed of dark?"
: Steven Wright

Is this where the line forms, cos you're preaching to the choir honey. I
now carry mints to offer my stinky friends. I have become quite
sanctimonious. And part of me doesn't like it, but there is that little
bitchy part of me that wants to twist the knife. LOL The worst is watching
people smoke in their cars. Now I go "ewwwwwww" and only a few years ago
that was me. ( we didn't smoke in our new cars when we bought them, a deal
we made with the kid.)

Sarah

"writer272002" <writer272002@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1183832979.762019.94240@n2g2000hse.googlegrou ps.com...
: You guys are a bunch of smug non-smokers, the people you swore you'd
: never become.
: And *sigh* sadly, that includes me.
:
: Smuggy Ashley
:
sigh indeed......feels good though, doesn't it?

Sanctimonious Sarah

"AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:3hEji.16648$09.1876@bignews8.bellsouth.net...
: It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
: are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class
than
: regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
: nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue
collar
: people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education
level.
: I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the
streets,
: and at work.
: The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
: people that cannot afford that addiction.
:
: Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am
open
: to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions
:
: --
: AZ
:
Up here in the land of rape and pillage by the government, it saddens me to
watch the marginalized struggle. Cigarettes cost over 10 dollars for a pack
of 25, and I know all about trying to find money to fund that. I wish that
instead of commercials to get people to quit, which for me made me want to
smoke more, I would rather see subsidisation of quitting tools for
impoverished smokers. Too bad we can't bottle AS3 and get the whole world
to see the light, eh. Too many things are targeted towards those that need
it the least, like pawn shops and payday advance places. Of course they
charge a lot, cos if you need money that bad, you won't be thinking about
the future of how you will get your stuff back or cover the cheque you just
wrote. I know, we've been there. Steve and I have fought hard for
everything we have. We've been those people on welfare, struggling to raise
a child on 200 dollars a month. I feel sympathy for those who are poor and
struggling, sometimes for Steve and I, smoking was the only thing we could
do to relax. Fucking tobacco companies should be taken out back and shot if
you ask me. /end rant

Sarah

On Sat, 7 Jul 2007 13:39:30 -0600, "Steve and Sarah"
<sandskrieger@NOSPAM.yourlink.ca> wrote:

>
>"AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
>news:3hEji.16648$09.1876@bignews8.bellsouth.net.. .
>: It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
>: are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class
>than
>: regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
>: nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue
>collar
>: people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education
>level.
>: I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the
>streets,
>: and at work.
>: The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
>: people that cannot afford that addiction.
>:
>: Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am
>open
>: to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions
>:
>: --
>: AZ
>:
>Up here in the land of rape and pillage by the government, it saddens me to
>watch the marginalized struggle. Cigarettes cost over 10 dollars for a pack
>of 25, and I know all about trying to find money to fund that. I wish that
>instead of commercials to get people to quit, which for me made me want to
>smoke more,

Yep. Me, too.

> I would rather see subsidisation of quitting tools for
>impoverished smokers. Too bad we can't bottle AS3 and get the whole world
>to see the light, eh. Too many things are targeted towards those that need
>it the least, like pawn shops and payday advance places. Of course they
>charge a lot, cos if you need money that bad, you won't be thinking about
>the future of how you will get your stuff back or cover the cheque you just
>wrote. I know, we've been there. Steve and I have fought hard for
>everything we have. We've been those people on welfare, struggling to raise
>a child on 200 dollars a month.

BTDT. I think that's why they hired me at the welfare office. They
were tired of giving me money for doing nothing.

> I feel sympathy for those who are poor and
>struggling,

I do to a point. I feel sympathy and compassion for those who are in
that situation by fluke and are trying to get themselves out or are
*genuinely* too ill to do so. After 22 years of listening to
everyone's problems (and they *all* expect me to fix them) my heart is
pretty much bled dry. A few years back a client filed a complaint
against me because I wasn't "sympathetic" to her situation. She'd
rented a house that was way more than she could afford with the
expectation of getting Section 8 (government housing subsidies). For
whatever reason she didn't get it, had to sign over the lease to the
absent father of her two children who threw her out and kept the kids
and she ended up homeless. So, I wasn't sympathetic. She got herself
into the mess and had a real nasty attitude (not just about that).
<shrug>
Sue

> sometimes for Steve and I, smoking was the only thing we could
>do to relax. Fucking tobacco companies should be taken out back and shot if
>you ask me. /end rant
>
>Sarah
>

What's the view like from up on that high horse you're on?

Distant, i expect.


On 7 Jul, 20:28, "Steve and Sarah" <sandskrie...@NOSPAM.yourlink.ca>
wrote:
> "writer272002" <writer272...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1183832979.762019.94240@n2g2000hse.googlegrou ps.com...
> : You guys are a bunch of smug non-smokers, the people you swore you'd
> : never become.
> : And *sigh* sadly, that includes me.
> :
> : Smuggy Ashley
> :
> sigh indeed......feels good though, doesn't it?
>
> Sanctimonious Sarah

Hey man, whatever it takes to keep me quit. YMMV if you don't like me and
my high horse then Plonk me, baby. How are you doing with your quit btw,
you don't post too much. Hope you are well.

Sarah
Eight months, three weeks, four days, 21 hours, 36 minutes and 37 seconds.
6722 cigarettes not smoked, saving $2,689.00. Life saved: 3 weeks, 2 days, 8
hours, 10 minutes.

"Aman M" <amanmahal@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1183852036.507035.302680@n2g2000hse.googlegro ups.com...
: What's the view like from up on that high horse you're on?
:
: Distant, i expect.
:
:
: On 7 Jul, 20:28, "Steve and Sarah" <sandskrie...@NOSPAM.yourlink.ca>
: wrote:
: > "writer272002" <writer272...@gmail.com> wrote in message
: >
: > news:1183832979.762019.94240@n2g2000hse.googlegrou ps.com...
: > : You guys are a bunch of smug non-smokers, the people you swore you'd
: > : never become.
: > : And *sigh* sadly, that includes me.
: > :
: > : Smuggy Ashley
: > :
: > sigh indeed......feels good though, doesn't it?
: >
: > Sanctimonious Sarah
:
:

Sarah, your point is valid and good. Yes, I see the horrors of
smoking commercials on TV often and frankly they did not influence me
to quit. Rather I chose to do so because I knew it was and still is
the right choice for me. What amazes me is when I tell others about
AS3, they just don't get it and come here to get smober. Quitting is
so much easier when you have buddies to hang out with and rant and
rave when you need to do so as well as to celebrate both the small and
big milestones we all reach.

FlatironMike
FSS
Four months, three weeks, five days, 23 hours, 36 minutes and 8
seconds. 2939 cigarettes not smoked, saving $881.65. Life saved: 1
week, 3 days, 4 hours, 55 minutes.

On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 23:47:16 -0000, Aman M <amanmahal@gmail.com>
wrote:

>What's the view like from up on that high horse you're on?
>
>Distant, i expect.

Not at all, but it is smoke free. :-)

--
BessieBee

"OK, so what's the speed of dark?"
Steven Wright

Sue, I was so kidding. I don't look down on smokers either. Indeed, I
feel sorry for them. I was just calling us smug joking around
(although Sanctimonious Sarah is just fine with me).

And as an aside, I covered "social services," which included child
welfare, the homeless etc., for years as a reporter, and I share your
view on people who refuse to do anything to better their situation. I
am sympathetic to those who truly deserve my sympathy. Maybe I got
jaded somewhere along the way but those seemed to get fewer and
further between.

Sarah .... it costs 10 FUCKING DOLLARS for a pack of cigarettes up
there??? Good Lord! That's highway robbery.

hugs
me

"writer272002" <writer272002@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1183861769.055251.75760@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
: Sue, I was so kidding. I don't look down on smokers either. Indeed, I
: feel sorry for them. I was just calling us smug joking around
: (although Sanctimonious Sarah is just fine with me).
:
: And as an aside, I covered "social services," which included child
: welfare, the homeless etc., for years as a reporter, and I share your
: view on people who refuse to do anything to better their situation. I
: am sympathetic to those who truly deserve my sympathy. Maybe I got
: jaded somewhere along the way but those seemed to get fewer and
: further between.
:
: Sarah .... it costs 10 FUCKING DOLLARS for a pack of cigarettes up
: there??? Good Lord! That's highway robbery.
:
: hugs
: me
:
Yes, every time I bought a pack I'd make the cashier pinch my nipples, cos
that's what I like when I'm getting fucked. Just kidding. Seriously,
that is what we used to pay. That is why Steve could afford a bike by
quitting smoking. Ridiculous, the amount of money we pissed up the wall
over the years.

hugs and kisses
myself

"Sue" <sebrady@thegrid.net> wrote in message
news:veov83531lljql5a2f3run369dt59n6rt6@4ax.com...
:
: I'm not sure that AZ meant looking down on smokers. I think what he
: meant was that it seems that the better educated/higher social class
: people aren't smoking anymore. Maybe I'm wrong. I sure don't look
: down on anyone for smoking.

You're right Sue, I think that's what he prbably meant, but What Leslie
wrote just was so much who I have become, I had to chime in. I guess I am
guilty of a few of the seven deadly sins. But at least I don't smoke.

: >
: >As a smoker I used to hate hearing "reformed" smokers talk about
: >having quit, how much better it was, yada yada yada. I swore that if
: >I ever did quit I'd never be like that, but since I'd quit only when
: >they pried the smokes from my cold dead fingers I'd never have to
: >worry about being "a reformed smoker."
: >
: >Well, now that I am smober I find myself becoming the bitch that just
: >can't help telling people how great it is to be a non-smoker. Just
: >what I used to hate.
:
: I would never do that. I'm a bitch but not about anyone's smoking. I
: pretty much don't mention it as it's none of my business. Of course,
: I make posts here about the benefits and I mention to my GMF every now
: and again how glad I am, but he never smoked so I'm not poking at him.

Good on ya Sue. I have such respect for you being able to be empathetic
with those that still smoke.

: >
: >I think it's the arrogance that comes with that attitude that makes me
: >think less of smokers.
:
: I have so many failings that it would be hypocritical of me to turn my
: nose up at smokers.
:
I guess I'm a hypocrite, but I'm okay with that.

: > Even as I type that I feel like a bitch. I
: >really don't think less of smokers, but, on the other hand....
:
: I'm not in a position to think less of anyone for smoking.

You are just too sweet for words, Sue. Your attitude belies your belief
that you are a A+ double rectified stubborn bitch. Did I get that right,
hon? I wish I was as honerable in my attitudes as you are.

: >
: >And yes, there were times as a smoker that I'd buy stink sticks and
: >THEN figure out what I could afford from the grocery.
: >
: >Nicotine addiction is nasty shit.

I'll second that statement.

: Yes, it is. I don't look down on smokers, I don't feel sorry for
: them, I don't want to raise cig taxes or further confine smokers in
: any way. That's just me. I haven't forgotten and I despise social
: engineering of this type by government.
: See? Told ya I'm a bitch.
: Sue - stepping down now.
:
That statement doesn't make you a bitch, honey, it makes you truly
empathetic to the addiction of others. Whereas I have become a bitch. Its
all in the way you look at it.

Hugs and kisses, cos I love you Sue

Sarah

"Sue" <sebrady@thegrid.net> wrote in message
news:066093l2jhc7oa58m12d6jeub7p852bfod@4ax.com...
: >:
: >Up here in the land of rape and pillage by the government, it saddens me
to
: >watch the marginalized struggle. Cigarettes cost over 10 dollars for a
pack
: >of 25, and I know all about trying to find money to fund that. I wish
that
: >instead of commercials to get people to quit, which for me made me want
to
: >smoke more,
:
: Yep. Me, too.
:
We're really a couple of 2 year olda at heart aren't we? I don't wanna and
you can't make me! So there! At least that is how I see myself when I am
being that stubborn.

: > I would rather see subsidisation of quitting tools for
: >impoverished smokers. Too bad we can't bottle AS3 and get the whole
world
: >to see the light, eh. Too many things are targeted towards those that
need
: >it the least, like pawn shops and payday advance places. Of course they
: >charge a lot, cos if you need money that bad, you won't be thinking about
: >the future of how you will get your stuff back or cover the cheque you
just
: >wrote. I know, we've been there. Steve and I have fought hard for
: >everything we have. We've been those people on welfare, struggling to
raise
: >a child on 200 dollars a month.
:
: BTDT. I think that's why they hired me at the welfare office. They
: were tired of giving me money for doing nothing.

I couldnt' get a job at the welfare office here, I am not of First Nations
status, so I am out of luck. <mutter mutter mutter>

: > I feel sympathy for those who are poor and
: >struggling,
:
: I do to a point. I feel sympathy and compassion for those who are in
: that situation by fluke and are trying to get themselves out or are
: *genuinely* too ill to do so. After 22 years of listening to
: everyone's problems (and they *all* expect me to fix them) my heart is
: pretty much bled dry. A few years back a client filed a complaint
: against me because I wasn't "sympathetic" to her situation. She'd
: rented a house that was way more than she could afford with the
: expectation of getting Section 8 (government housing subsidies). For
: whatever reason she didn't get it, had to sign over the lease to the
: absent father of her two children who threw her out and kept the kids
: and she ended up homeless. So, I wasn't sympathetic. She got herself
: into the mess and had a real nasty attitude (not just about that).
: <shrug>
: Sue
Preaching to the choir honey, preaching to the choir. We just had an
article in the local paper about a couple on welfare that won $5000 dollars
at bingo. It took them a while to report it, * no explanation as to why
they waited) and in the meantime, were reported for their bingo win. They
say they spent it on house repairs and car repairs, but amazingly have no
receipts to prove where they spent the money, and are pissed off that they
have to pay back welfare the money that they got when they didn't report the
winnings. Up here you are allowed to claim 200 dollars and the rest must be
used for basic living expenses. I don't know how it works for you. So now
they are crying in the papers about how welfare cut them off and they are
going to lose their house. Guess they should have claimed their winnings,
eh?

A number of years ago, Steve and I were going through a really rough patch
financially, and he was unemployed for a number of months. It got so bad
that we were going to declare bankruptcy and it ended up that we couldn't
because we were too poor to afford the bankruptcy payments. How sad is
that. When we called for assistance to get some food from the food bank, we
were told "no" because we weren't of First Nations origins. Same response
at the welfare office. It is so frustrating sometimes. I don't know where
I'm going with this, but it feels good to get it out. LOL Sorry for the
long whiny ramble.

/me ends the pity party and has a beer

Sarah

"FlatIronMike" <FlatironMikeNYC@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1183860425.663503.258140@d55g2000hsg.googlegr oups.com...
: Sarah, your point is valid and good. Yes, I see the horrors of
: smoking commercials on TV often and frankly they did not influence me
: to quit. Rather I chose to do so because I knew it was and still is
: the right choice for me. What amazes me is when I tell others about
: AS3, they just don't get it and come here to get smober. Quitting is
: so much easier when you have buddies to hang out with and rant and
: rave when you need to do so as well as to celebrate both the small and
: big milestones we all reach.
:
: FlatironMike
: FSS
: Four months, three weeks, five days, 23 hours, 36 minutes and 8
: seconds. 2939 cigarettes not smoked, saving $881.65. Life saved: 1
: week, 3 days, 4 hours, 55 minutes.

Mike, you are right. I think this place is the bestest place for me ever.
And not just for quitting smoking. I love how I feel when I am here, and
miss it when I am otherwise occupied. I may end up with carpal tunnel
syndrome from all the typing, but that is a hell of a lot better than
cancer.

Hugs and kisses

Sarah

Let me clear up something really important here. I am an alcoholic. I hate
the word "recovering" because once you're one, you're always one.
In the AA meetings that I attended 5 years ago, and I still attend even
nowadays, one of the first thing you learn is not to Judge people. I was
not judging people or looking down on smokers. I was merely making an
observation, arrogant it might be, but it meant no harm, nor did it mean I
was looking down on anybody. If I was misunderstood, and offended someone,
I'm sorry. I have not changed what I think though. I just hope you
understand my point better now.
September 5th, I get my 5 year coin for being Sober. Man, I can't wait to
get that coin for being Smober as well.

--
AZ
"Steve and Sarah" <sandskrieger@NOSPAM.yourlink.ca> wrote in message
news:f74172$5nh$1@utornnr1pp.grouptelecom.net...
>
> "writer272002" <writer272002@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1183861769.055251.75760@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
> : Sue, I was so kidding. I don't look down on smokers either. Indeed, I
> : feel sorry for them. I was just calling us smug joking around
> : (although Sanctimonious Sarah is just fine with me).
> :
> : And as an aside, I covered "social services," which included child
> : welfare, the homeless etc., for years as a reporter, and I share your
> : view on people who refuse to do anything to better their situation. I
> : am sympathetic to those who truly deserve my sympathy. Maybe I got
> : jaded somewhere along the way but those seemed to get fewer and
> : further between.
> :
> : Sarah .... it costs 10 FUCKING DOLLARS for a pack of cigarettes up
> : there??? Good Lord! That's highway robbery.
> :
> : hugs
> : me
> :
> Yes, every time I bought a pack I'd make the cashier pinch my nipples, cos
> that's what I like when I'm getting fucked. Just kidding. Seriously,
> that is what we used to pay. That is why Steve could afford a bike by
> quitting smoking. Ridiculous, the amount of money we pissed up the wall
> over the years.
>
> hugs and kisses
> myself
>
>

On Jul 7, 12:04 am, "AZ" <azi...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
> are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class than
> regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
> nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue collar
> people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education level.
> I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the streets,
> and at work.
> The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
> people that cannot afford that addiction.
>
> Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am open
> to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions
>
> --
> AZ

It's arrogant, but an observation I have made (not proud to say, but
being honest) and it has been part of what has kept me quit. If you
really want arrogant, I've now decided women smokers look 'loose' -
seriously, that's what it looks like in my eyes - and I don't want to
appear that way.

Embarrassed at my own judgmental nature, but anything to keep me off
the butts, Stephanie

"AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:h0pli.21612$09.10313@bignews8.bellsouth.net.. .
: Let me clear up something really important here. I am an alcoholic. I
hate
: the word "recovering" because once you're one, you're always one.
: In the AA meetings that I attended 5 years ago, and I still attend even
: nowadays, one of the first thing you learn is not to Judge people. I was
: not judging people or looking down on smokers. I was merely making an
: observation, arrogant it might be, but it meant no harm, nor did it mean I
: was looking down on anybody. If I was misunderstood, and offended
someone,
: I'm sorry. I have not changed what I think though. I just hope you
: understand my point better now.
: September 5th, I get my 5 year coin for being Sober. Man, I can't wait to
: get that coin for being Smober as well.
:
: --
: AZ
5 years sober is a wonderful accomplishment, AZ and I have no doubt that
you will get the 5 year smober prize too, although, around here I doubt if
it will be a coin. I have never had to do a recovery program, and I
wish I could be a less judgemental person. I hope I didn't offend you with
my attitude, honey.

hugs

Sarah

Offended me? Not at all, I thought I was the offender.
I'll make a deal with ya...let's get off this subject
I just got home and my honey is making dinner. She won't say what it is,
but I'm sure it'll be gooooood.

Later

--
AZ
"Steve and Sarah" <sandskrieger@NOSPAM.yourlink.ca> wrote in message
news:f75nui$cdb$1@utornnr1pp.grouptelecom.net...
>
> "AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:h0pli.21612$09.10313@bignews8.bellsouth.net.. .
> : Let me clear up something really important here. I am an alcoholic. I
> hate
> : the word "recovering" because once you're one, you're always one.
> : In the AA meetings that I attended 5 years ago, and I still attend even
> : nowadays, one of the first thing you learn is not to Judge people. I
> was
> : not judging people or looking down on smokers. I was merely making an
> : observation, arrogant it might be, but it meant no harm, nor did it mean
> I
> : was looking down on anybody. If I was misunderstood, and offended
> someone,
> : I'm sorry. I have not changed what I think though. I just hope you
> : understand my point better now.
> : September 5th, I get my 5 year coin for being Sober. Man, I can't wait
> to
> : get that coin for being Smober as well.
> :
> : --
> : AZ
> 5 years sober is a wonderful accomplishment, AZ and I have no doubt that
> you will get the 5 year smober prize too, although, around here I doubt if
> it will be a coin. I have never had to do a recovery program, and I
> wish I could be a less judgemental person. I hope I didn't offend you
> with
> my attitude, honey.
>
> hugs
>
> Sarah
>
>

"AZ" <azikra@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:Lezli.10237$yD2.4295@bignews1.bellsouth.net.. .
: Offended me? Not at all, I thought I was the offender.
: I'll make a deal with ya...let's get off this subject
: I just got home and my honey is making dinner. She won't say what it is,
: but I'm sure it'll be gooooood.
:
: Later
:
Soooooooo....are you golfing this weekend??

Sarah

What I know for sure is that up until a few days ago, every time I
went outside in the rain and snow or snuck around the corner or stood
in the bathroom with the fan on to smoke a cigarette, I felt pretty
low-class.

Phil
I haven't smoked since 7/8/2007 2:30 PM and that means that the TC and
the taxman didn't get $21.56 of my money. The TC gets to keep 86
cigarettes though but I can be smug about it for an extra 7 hours and
10 minutes.


On Jul 7, 12:04 am, "AZ" <azi...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> It might only be me, but I have been noticing that people who smoke
> are..please excuse me for saying this..but they seem of a lesser class than
> regular people. I don't know how to explain my opinion. But the smokers
> nowadays, it seems to me, are lower class of people, pretty much blue collar
> people, and I mean no disrespect by that, and have a lower education level.
> I might be full of shit, but that is what I have seen lately on the streets,
> and at work.
> The funniest thing is, I think the people that smoke the most, are the
> people that cannot afford that addiction.
>
> Thank you for listening...err..reading. All opinions are welcome. I am open
> to both sides. Not for arguing,but rather just hear your opinions
>
> --
> AZ

"writer272002" <writer272002@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1183861769.055251.75760@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
> Sue, I was so kidding. I don't look down on smokers either. Indeed, I
> feel sorry for them. I was just calling us smug joking around
> (although Sanctimonious Sarah is just fine with me).
>
> And as an aside, I covered "social services," which included child
> welfare, the homeless etc., for years as a reporter, and I share your
> view on people who refuse to do anything to better their situation. I
> am sympathetic to those who truly deserve my sympathy. Maybe I got
> jaded somewhere along the way but those seemed to get fewer and
> further between.

Interesting. I work for a social service agency and I've been witnessing
the same things you have for over 25 years.
Some of these folks are stuck, and it's truly sad. Having been working at
this for as long as I have, I'm now seeing "second generation" cases. You
know, people on public assistance having children and now those children are
grown up and on assistance while having their own children. So the pattern
continues.

I don't know if I'm jaded; maybe numb somewhat. After all this time, there
just isn't much which surprises me anymore. Every so often, I see a success
story (such as the C.D. who went through fifteen treatments, god knows how
many spin-dry's, and then something suddenly clicks and now they're
long-term sober....seeing that makes this all worthwhile), and it's awesome.
But mostly, it's just people stuck, either by choice or by not understanding
there's a different path for them, or by the lack of mental capacity to
change.

>
> Sarah .... it costs 10 FUCKING DOLLARS for a pack of cigarettes up
> there??? Good Lord! That's highway robbery.
>
> hugs
> me
>

Ten bucks....yikes. I was at Walgreens tonight buying milk and noticed that
my old brand is nearly five bucks a pack, and thought to myself "shit, I'd
be paying fifteen bucks a day now!". And you know what? If I was smoking,
I'd pay it. I wouldn't cut back. I'd justify the cost, no matter what. I
would've found a way to afford it. It's what addiction does. It screws up
priorities. It takes things. Money, dignity, health, a whole host of shit.

Today I'm sober and smober and grateful.

Lee
OOF

--
Hawaiian trapped in a Minnesotan's body

"Lee in Duluth MN" <blahblahblah@albundy.com> wrote in message
news:uqCli.672$kt7.518@newsfe12.lga...
:
: > And as an aside, I covered "social services," which included child
: > welfare, the homeless etc., for years as a reporter, and I share your
: > view on people who refuse to do anything to better their situation. I
: > am sympathetic to those who truly deserve my sympathy. Maybe I got
: > jaded somewhere along the way but those seemed to get fewer and
: > further between.
:
: Interesting. I work for a social service agency and I've been witnessing
: the same things you have for over 25 years.
: Some of these folks are stuck, and it's truly sad. Having been working at
: this for as long as I have, I'm now seeing "second generation" cases. You
: know, people on public assistance having children and now those children
are
: grown up and on assistance while having their own children. So the
pattern
: continues.
:
: I don't know if I'm jaded; maybe numb somewhat. After all this time,
there
: just isn't much which surprises me anymore. Every so often, I see a
success
: story (such as the C.D. who went through fifteen treatments, god knows how
: many spin-dry's, and then something suddenly clicks and now they're
: long-term sober....seeing that makes this all worthwhile), and it's
awesome.
: But mostly, it's just people stuck, either by choice or by not
understanding
: there's a different path for them, or by the lack of mental capacity to
: change.

I've been on the other side, and I don't know what it is like in the US, but
up here it is very hard to get off social assistance once you are on. When
we got off, we lost the healthcare coverage, we lost cheap public
transportation, we lost a lot, but were determined to pick ourselves up and
make a better life. Most people are too discouraged. We were lucky to have
an extended support system which a lot of people don't. It is a real catch
22 situation.

: >
: > Sarah .... it costs 10 FUCKING DOLLARS for a pack of cigarettes up
: > there??? Good Lord! That's highway robbery.
:
: Ten bucks....yikes. I was at Walgreens tonight buying milk and noticed
that
: my old brand is nearly five bucks a pack, and thought to myself "shit, I'd
: be paying fifteen bucks a day now!". And you know what? If I was
smoking,
: I'd pay it. I wouldn't cut back. I'd justify the cost, no matter what.
I
: would've found a way to afford it. It's what addiction does. It screws
up
: priorities. It takes things. Money, dignity, health, a whole host of
shit.
:
: Today I'm sober and smober and grateful.
:
: Lee
: OOF
: Hawaiian trapped in a Minnesotan's body
:
Amen to that brother!! I look at my past self, and how I justified paying
those prices with a great sense of sorrow and a whole lot of smugness for
growing and changing into the person I am becoming now! And 10 bucks was
the 9 months ago price, I have no idea what they have been raised to by now,
9 months later!

We will be in Minneapolis in 13 days Lee!! I will be thinking of you as we
drive through your state!

Hugs!

Sarah and Steve

I know, Lee. I'd still be paying it too. Honestly, I still have no
money; I have no idea where all these savings are. Maybe I just
haven't saved enough yet. I cannot for the life of me figure out where
I got the money to smoke in the first place.

My problem is, I'm house poor. I should *not* have spent this much to
buy a house at the upper limit of what I could afford. Sigh.


Ashley

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 22:36:11 -0500, "Lee in Duluth MN"
<blahblahblah@albundy.com> wrote:

>
>"writer272002" <writer272002@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1183861769.055251.75760@g4g2000hsf.googlegro ups.com...
>> Sue, I was so kidding. I don't look down on smokers either. Indeed, I
>> feel sorry for them. I was just calling us smug joking around
>> (although Sanctimonious Sarah is just fine with me).
>>
>> And as an aside, I covered "social services," which included child
>> welfare, the homeless etc., for years as a reporter, and I share your
>> view on people who refuse to do anything to better their situation. I
>> am sympathetic to those who truly deserve my sympathy. Maybe I got
>> jaded somewhere along the way but those seemed to get fewer and
>> further between.
>
>Interesting. I work for a social service agency and I've been witnessing
>the same things you have for over 25 years.

You, too?

>Some of these folks are stuck, and it's truly sad. Having been working at
>this for as long as I have, I'm now seeing "second generation" cases. You
>know, people on public assistance having children and now those children are
>grown up and on assistance while having their own children. So the pattern
>continues.

Yes, I've got some of those, too. One of these young ladies whom I've
known since birth greets me like I'm her second mother - big hug every
time.

>
>I don't know if I'm jaded; maybe numb somewhat. After all this time, there
>just isn't much which surprises me anymore.

Yep.

> Every so often, I see a success
>story (such as the C.D. who went through fifteen treatments, god knows how
>many spin-dry's, and then something suddenly clicks and now they're
>long-term sober....seeing that makes this all worthwhile), and it's awesome.

One of my former clients was working on her master in business last I
heard. It does give hope when they take advantage of "the system" in
a positive way.

>But mostly, it's just people stuck, either by choice or by not understanding
>there's a different path for them, or by the lack of mental capacity to
>change.

What saddens me (and, being hard hearted, angers me a bit) is seeing
these women who raised their children on cash aid that ran out when
the last kid turned 18 they come into the office and ask, "What am I
going to do now?" I have been known to tell them to go home and look
in the mirror and ask *that* person. But, I say it nicely. They
generally end up living with a relative or friend on their $155 per
month in food stamps, doing nothing and basically waiting to die.
Sue

On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 12:32:15 -0600, "Steve and Sarah"
<sandskrieger@NOSPAM.yourlink.ca> wrote:

>
>"Lee in Duluth MN" <blahblahblah@albundy.com> wrote in message
>news:uqCli.672$kt7.518@newsfe12.lga...
>:
>: > And as an aside, I covered "social services," which included child
>: > welfare, the homeless etc., for years as a reporter, and I share your
>: > view on people who refuse to do anything to better their situation. I
>: > am sympathetic to those who truly deserve my sympathy. Maybe I got
>: > jaded somewhere along the way but those seemed to get fewer and
>: > further between.
>:
>: Interesting. I work for a social service agency and I've been witnessing
>: the same things you have for over 25 years.
>: Some of these folks are stuck, and it's truly sad. Having been working at
>: this for as long as I have, I'm now seeing "second generation" cases. You
>: know, people on public assistance having children and now those children
>are
>: grown up and on assistance while having their own children. So the
>pattern
>: continues.
>:
>: I don't know if I'm jaded; maybe numb somewhat. After all this time,
>there
>: just