Fat Loss, revisited

Guys, I've really become very discouraged with losing fat. I've taken
all of the advice I can for a year and a half now, but really see very
little difference.

The weight lifting is great. I can bench over 400lbs, and can squat
over 600. My bulk is great, my shoulders and legs look awesome, and my
calves are my new favorite body part! I've never had division there
before, so this is pretty cool.

But my problem area is my midsection. My waist is 34", and my
midsection (around the belly button) is 39". I can see a faint outline
of abs along the sides and upper part of my abs, but just fat at the
lower part and obliques. This is the exact same measurement that I had
a year and a half ago, so if I've lost any fat at all, the measuring
tape doesn't show it.

I've posted before, and the advice is generally "get your diet under
control." That's just it, though; I don't see how I could get it more
under control!

Here's an average day for me:

Breakfast: whole wheat cereal with 2% milk. On weekends I switch this
to an omelet (eggs, cheese, peppers, maybe some diced ham).

Lunch: turkey or chicken breast sandwich on whole wheat bread, with
lettuce and maybe tomato. For a side, I typically do something with
sweet potatoes for fiber.

Post Lunch: I've taken a liking to the South Beach diet bars. They
have around 150 calories, 11g of protein, and low sugar.

Dinner: 8oz chicken breast or tuna steak, whole grain rice, maybe
asparagus or corn. Sometimes I add low-sodium cream of chicken soup to
the rice for flavor, and the chicken is grilled unless it's raining
outside.

After Dinner / Pre Workout: a bowl of cooked oatmeal, sometimes with a
scoop of protein added in or cooked with soy milk.

I drink 4-5 bottles of water (24 oz) per day, and usually drink
unsweetened tea with meals. I might drink a Coke Zero on weekends, but
we're talking 4-6 cans a month.

On weekends, I might do a steak or pasta, just to keep my taste buds
alive. And maybe once a month I'll have a few friends over, and we'll
drink a couple of martinis; still, we're talking 2 or 3 a month.

I take a protein supplement before and after working out (the Pro
SLAMM shots), glutamine, and creatine. I also take a multivitamin and
Lysine (to prevent cold sores; nothing to do with lifting), and I
might drink another protein shake 30 minutes or so after the workout
if my protein is low that day. I've been using thermogenics (coral
calcium and green tea) for about a year, but stopped recently when I
felt like they had no impact. I also take chromium, but was planning
to drop it when I run out, for the same reason (don't see a
difference).

I've completely removed regular soda from my diet (I used to drink 3-4
a day), anything that says enriched (white bread, rice, etc), and have
lowered my sodium substantially. I've always eaten a lot of chicken,
but before I started lifting, my dinner would be more like a chicken
breast, mashed potatoes, macaroni & cheese, and 2-3 biscuits or rolls.
So what I'm doing now is a pretty big difference.

For about a year, I simply did heavy lifting and watched my food
intake as above. About 4 months ago, though, I realized that there had
been no change in my belly, so I cut out a lot of the smaller
exercises (bench flyes, calf press, curls, lat bar, etc), and instead
added 45 minutes of treadmill to my routine, so I'm doing cardio 4
days a week. On the treadmill, I discovered that my endurance was for
crap, so I'm building it up slowly using the Fartlek method (on an
incline of 5, I'll run at 6mph for 1/4 mile, then power walk at 4mph
for 1/4 mile, then run again, then walk again; I do this for 45
minutes, which is about 3 miles).

I figured that the cardio would really make a difference, but after 4
months I'm the exact same measurement at the midsection as before:
39". About 10 years ago (before I hurt my hand and took a break from
lifting), my chest was the same that it is now (46"), my legs were the
same (28"), but my waist was 32". I also weighed around 155, where now
I'm at 185.

So, what gives? On paper, it seems like I'm doing everything right,
but everything says you should start to see results in 2-3 months; not
2-3 years!

"Jason Carlton" <jwcarlton@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:87e7a5e1-e7bf-4119-bd00-439b85a2bf53@m73g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Guys, I've really become very discouraged with losing fat. I've taken
> all of the advice I can for a year and a half now, but really see very
> little difference.
>
> The weight lifting is great. I can bench over 400lbs, and can squat
> over 600. My bulk is great, my shoulders and legs look awesome, and my
> calves are my new favorite body part! I've never had division there
> before, so this is pretty cool.
>
> But my problem area is my midsection. My waist is 34", and my
> midsection (around the belly button) is 39". I can see a faint outline
> of abs along the sides and upper part of my abs, but just fat at the
> lower part and obliques. This is the exact same measurement that I had
> a year and a half ago, so if I've lost any fat at all, the measuring
> tape doesn't show it.
>
> I've posted before, and the advice is generally "get your diet under
> control." That's just it, though; I don't see how I could get it more
> under control!
>
> Here's an average day for me:
>
> Breakfast: whole wheat cereal with 2% milk. On weekends I switch this
> to an omelet (eggs, cheese, peppers, maybe some diced ham).
>
> Lunch: turkey or chicken breast sandwich on whole wheat bread, with
> lettuce and maybe tomato. For a side, I typically do something with
> sweet potatoes for fiber.
>
> Post Lunch: I've taken a liking to the South Beach diet bars. They
> have around 150 calories, 11g of protein, and low sugar.
>
> Dinner: 8oz chicken breast or tuna steak, whole grain rice, maybe
> asparagus or corn. Sometimes I add low-sodium cream of chicken soup to
> the rice for flavor, and the chicken is grilled unless it's raining
> outside.
>
> After Dinner / Pre Workout: a bowl of cooked oatmeal, sometimes with a
> scoop of protein added in or cooked with soy milk.
>
> I drink 4-5 bottles of water (24 oz) per day, and usually drink
> unsweetened tea with meals. I might drink a Coke Zero on weekends, but
> we're talking 4-6 cans a month.
>
> On weekends, I might do a steak or pasta, just to keep my taste buds
> alive. And maybe once a month I'll have a few friends over, and we'll
> drink a couple of martinis; still, we're talking 2 or 3 a month.
>
> I take a protein supplement before and after working out (the Pro
> SLAMM shots), glutamine, and creatine. I also take a multivitamin and
> Lysine (to prevent cold sores; nothing to do with lifting), and I
> might drink another protein shake 30 minutes or so after the workout
> if my protein is low that day. I've been using thermogenics (coral
> calcium and green tea) for about a year, but stopped recently when I
> felt like they had no impact. I also take chromium, but was planning
> to drop it when I run out, for the same reason (don't see a
> difference).
>
> I've completely removed regular soda from my diet (I used to drink 3-4
> a day), anything that says enriched (white bread, rice, etc), and have
> lowered my sodium substantially. I've always eaten a lot of chicken,
> but before I started lifting, my dinner would be more like a chicken
> breast, mashed potatoes, macaroni & cheese, and 2-3 biscuits or rolls.
> So what I'm doing now is a pretty big difference.
>
> For about a year, I simply did heavy lifting and watched my food
> intake as above. About 4 months ago, though, I realized that there had
> been no change in my belly, so I cut out a lot of the smaller
> exercises (bench flyes, calf press, curls, lat bar, etc), and instead
> added 45 minutes of treadmill to my routine, so I'm doing cardio 4
> days a week. On the treadmill, I discovered that my endurance was for
> crap, so I'm building it up slowly using the Fartlek method (on an
> incline of 5, I'll run at 6mph for 1/4 mile, then power walk at 4mph
> for 1/4 mile, then run again, then walk again; I do this for 45
> minutes, which is about 3 miles).
>
> I figured that the cardio would really make a difference, but after 4
> months I'm the exact same measurement at the midsection as before:
> 39". About 10 years ago (before I hurt my hand and took a break from
> lifting), my chest was the same that it is now (46"), my legs were the
> same (28"), but my waist was 32". I also weighed around 155, where now
> I'm at 185.
>
> So, what gives? On paper, it seems like I'm doing everything right,
> but everything says you should start to see results in 2-3 months; not
> 2-3 years!

Try this: 1/2 container of egg beaters with 3 slices of fat free cheese, a
few slices of turkey bacon for breakfast, salad with vegetables, chicken and
a low carb dressing for lunch, a few apples mixed in during the day, a
relatively low carb dinner and a small amount of carbs sometime in the
evening to take the edge off. Drop the protein shakes and also try
intermittent fasting.

Check out Lyle McDonald's stuff and also Art Devaney's Evolutionary Fitness
(some of which is out there, but a lot of good advice if you're looking to
get lean.

"Jason Carlton" <jwcarlton@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:87e7a5e1-e7bf-4119-bd00-439b85a2bf53@m73g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Guys, I've really become very discouraged with losing fat. I've taken
> all of the advice I can for a year and a half now, but really see very
> little difference.
> -snip-
> I've posted before, and the advice is generally "get your diet under
> control." That's just it, though; I don't see how I could get it more
> under control!

To lose weight, eat less.

If you need to count calories, start a food diary on
http://www.fitday.com or similar. Once you see how many calories you
consume on average, try cutting back by 250 to 500 calories per day.
That should be good for a moderate, steady weight loss of 1/2 to 1 lb.
per week.

Many of us find it easier to eat less if we keep the carbohydrates
relatively low; I know I do.

Cut out _all_ soda. Stay as close to the source of the food as
possible, e.g., vegetables fresh or fresh-cooked.

Consider cyclic eating in some form, e.g., do a web search on "Warrior
Diet" and/or "Intermittent Fasting" and give one of those approaches a
try. I've been doing the WD approach for about 5 years.

[I'd like to see YouTube of a 185 lb. man benching 400 and squatting
600. Not that it hasn't been done, but it's not very common, either.]

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

> To lose weight, eat less.
>
> If you need to count calories, start a food diary onhttp://www.fitday.comor similar. *Once you see how many calories you
> consume on average, try cutting back by 250 to 500 calories per day.
> That should be good for a moderate, steady weight loss of 1/2 to 1 lb.
> per week.

That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.


> Consider cyclic eating in some form, e.g., do a web search on "Warrior
> Diet" and/or "Intermittent Fasting" and give one of those approaches a
> try. *I've been doing the WD approach for about 5 years.

Thanks, I'll look for that. I've been researching ketosis dieting
recently due to a suggestion from another lifting friend, though, so I
might give that a shot first.


> [I'd like to see YouTube of a 185 lb. man benching 400 and squatting
> 600. *Not that it hasn't been done, but it's not very common, either.]

To be fair, I haven't maxed out in 6 months or more. But when I bench,
I start with a reverse pyramid (4/6/8), and my set of 4 is currently
at 365. So in theory, I should have an estimated max of 410.

Squats have always been easy for me. I'm only 5' 4, so I don't exactly
have a long way to go :-)

If I had a way to create a video, I'd gladly record it for you. I'm
pretty proud of it, personally. Or you're welcome to come to N.
Carolina and spot me; I need a workout partner, anyway! LOL

In article <4847577a$0$11603$607ed4bc@cv.net>,
"ATP*" <waxwingslain@azurepane.com> wrote:

> > So, what gives? On paper, it seems like I'm doing everything right,
> > but everything says you should start to see results in 2-3 months; not
> > 2-3 years!
>
> Try this: 1/2 container of egg beaters with 3 slices of fat free cheese, a
> few slices of turkey bacon for breakfast, salad with vegetables, chicken and
> a low carb dressing for lunch, a few apples mixed in during the day, a
> relatively low carb dinner and a small amount of carbs sometime in the
> evening to take the edge off. Drop the protein shakes and also try
> intermittent fasting.
>
> Check out Lyle McDonald's stuff and also Art Devaney's Evolutionary Fitness
> (some of which is out there, but a lot of good advice if you're looking to
> get lean.

Replacing the starchy carbs (bread and cereal) with fresh, high fiber
green veggies is a good suggestion.

Works for me if I stick to it. ;-)

Indulge once in awhile to keep your sanity, but don't go overboard when
you do.
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

In article
<cef1373a-fccb-4d0d-ace4-fb55e108348a@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
Jason Carlton <jwcarlton@gmail.com> wrote:

> That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
> a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.

Some calories count more than others. Try cutting out the starch for a
couple of weeks and see if that helps.
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

Dnia 2008-06-06 Omelet napisa³(a):
> In article
><cef1373a-fccb-4d0d-ace4-fb55e108348a@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
> Jason Carlton <jwcarlton@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
>> a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.
>
> Some calories count more than others.

If so, they hide their effects from researchers.

> Try cutting out the starch for a couple of weeks and see if that helps.

It will. If you cut the most popular foods out of your diet, you end up
eating less. That works.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

> >> That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
> >> a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.
>
> > Some calories count more than others.
>
> If so, they hide their effects from researchers.
>
> > Try cutting out the starch for a couple of weeks and see if that helps.
>
> It will. *If you cut the most popular foods out of your diet, you end up
> eating less. *That works.
>
> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R


Alright, so I have a few questions about starchy carbs.

Is whole wheat good or bad? I tend to eat whole wheat bread 2-3 times
a week, and whole wheat pasta maybe once a week, although not to a
large degree.

Similarly, what about oatmeal? I'll commonly eat the Quaker kind that
you cook and mix in a scoop of protein about 30 minutes before a
workout.

Is brown rice OK? I switched to brown rice as opposed to white rice,
and eat a lot of it.

Sweet potatoes instead of regular potatoes? I usually eat a sweet
potato every day (in the form of chips, baked, or mashed), where I
used to eat regular potatoes once or twice a day. I'm under the
impression that it has far less carbs, and is a good source of fiber.


Last question. Andrzej, I've discussed things with you on here a lot
in the past, and I really don't know how to pronounce Andrzej. Is that
your name, or a handle? If it's your name, is it pronounced and-er-ZEJ
(3 syllables, with the emphasis on the last syllable)?

This is fairly important to me because you explained a shoulder
routine to me that you called the "Andrzej Lift," and I've shown it to
a few others locally and called it the same thing :-) So I need to
make sure I'm giving it the appropriate name!

Dnia 2008-06-06 Jason Carlton napisa³(a):
>> >> That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
>> >> a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.
>>
>> > Some calories count more than others.
>>
>> If so, they hide their effects from researchers.
>>
>> > Try cutting out the starch for a couple of weeks and see if that helps.
>>
>> It will. *If you cut the most popular foods out of your diet, you end up
>> eating less. *That works.
>>
>> --
>> Andrzej Rosa 1127R
>
>
> Alright, so I have a few questions about starchy carbs.
>
> Is whole wheat good or bad? I tend to eat whole wheat bread 2-3 times
> a week, and whole wheat pasta maybe once a week, although not to a
> large degree.
>
> Similarly, what about oatmeal? I'll commonly eat the Quaker kind that
> you cook and mix in a scoop of protein about 30 minutes before a
> workout.
>
> Is brown rice OK? I switched to brown rice as opposed to white rice,
> and eat a lot of it.
>
> Sweet potatoes instead of regular potatoes? I usually eat a sweet
> potato every day (in the form of chips, baked, or mashed), where I
> used to eat regular potatoes once or twice a day. I'm under the
> impression that it has far less carbs, and is a good source of fiber.

I'm not a diet specialist here. I really never was on a diet my whole
life, so I've no personal experience with them. In general I tend to
think that there is very little difference between various diets, but
personal preference, which I'm lacking.

But limiting yourself to some strange and exotic foods may work very
well the same way as I previously wrote. You throw away popular stuff,
so you end up eating less.

> Last question. Andrzej, I've discussed things with you on here a lot
> in the past, and I really don't know how to pronounce Andrzej. Is that
> your name, or a handle? If it's your name, is it pronounced and-er-ZEJ
> (3 syllables, with the emphasis on the last syllable)?

Unjay would be close enough for me. Two syllables. "rz" is one sound made
up of two letters, like for example "sh" in English. Polish names read
funny in English, but they sound fairly normal when you read them in
Polish. Of course English names can be a total jawbreaker if you try to
read them in Polish too.

> This is fairly important to me because you explained a shoulder
> routine to me that you called the "Andrzej Lift," and I've shown it to
> a few others locally and called it the same thing :-) So I need to
> make sure I'm giving it the appropriate name!

Damn, I thought I should remember the lift I supposedly invented, but I
do not. What was it?

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

>> Last question. Andrzej, I've discussed things with you on here a lot
>> in the past, and I really don't know how to pronounce Andrzej. Is
>> that
>> your name, or a handle? If it's your name, is it pronounced
>> and-er-ZEJ
>> (3 syllables, with the emphasis on the last syllable)?
>
> Unjay would be close enough for me. Two syllables. "rz" is one sound
> made
> up of two letters, like for example "sh" in English. Polish names
> read
> funny in English, but they sound fairly normal when you read them in
> Polish. Of course English names can be a total jawbreaker if you try
> to
> read them in Polish too.

The usual English mispronunciation of this name is "Andre," as in Andre
the Giant.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

In article <jrdoh5-8p2.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dnia 2008-06-06 Omelet napisa³(a):
> > In article
> ><cef1373a-fccb-4d0d-ace4-fb55e108348a@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
> > Jason Carlton <jwcarlton@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
> >> a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.
> >
> > Some calories count more than others.
>
> If so, they hide their effects from researchers.

Not so. :-) Never heard of "net carbs"?

>
> > Try cutting out the starch for a couple of weeks and see if that helps.
>
> It will. If you cut the most popular foods out of your diet, you end up
> eating less. That works.
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

Dnia 2008-06-07 Omelet napisa³(a):
> In article <jrdoh5-8p2.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
> Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Dnia 2008-06-06 Omelet napisa³(a):
>> > In article
>> ><cef1373a-fccb-4d0d-ace4-fb55e108348a@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
>> > Jason Carlton <jwcarlton@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
>> >> a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.
>> >
>> > Some calories count more than others.
>>
>> If so, they hide their effects from researchers.
>
> Not so. :-) Never heard of "net carbs"?

I heard that Krispy Kreme complained about them (they lost money due to
low carb diets).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical...ohydrate_diets

Here is an overview of research spanning a century. You'd think that
after such a long time there should be something stronger than "it
appears". But there is none. Low carb diets seem to work a bit better
for some people with diabetes and insulin response problems. A bit
better.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Dnia 2008-06-07 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
>>> Last question. Andrzej, I've discussed things with you on here a lot
>>> in the past, and I really don't know how to pronounce Andrzej. Is
>>> that
>>> your name, or a handle? If it's your name, is it pronounced
>>> and-er-ZEJ
>>> (3 syllables, with the emphasis on the last syllable)?
>>
>> Unjay would be close enough for me. Two syllables. "rz" is one sound
>> made
>> up of two letters, like for example "sh" in English. Polish names
>> read
>> funny in English, but they sound fairly normal when you read them in
>> Polish. Of course English names can be a total jawbreaker if you try
>> to
>> read them in Polish too.
>
> The usual English mispronunciation of this name is "Andre," as in Andre
> the Giant.

Fine too. Germans used to call me that. (But why would you assume that
"as in Andre the Giant" could serve as a clarification for someone who
probably never watched pro wrestling? I googled the guy, and am still
smiling due this pan-Americanism. ;-))

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

In article <jskph5-69d.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dnia 2008-06-07 Omelet napisa³(a):
> > In article <jrdoh5-8p2.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
> > Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Dnia 2008-06-06 Omelet napisa³(a):
> >> > In article
> >> ><cef1373a-fccb-4d0d-ace4-fb55e108348a@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
> >> > Jason Carlton <jwcarlton@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> That's what's getting me: I DO eat less! I've easily cut 500 calories
> >> >> a day from my diet, and it has had absolutely no impact whatsoever.
> >> >
> >> > Some calories count more than others.
> >>
> >> If so, they hide their effects from researchers.
> >
> > Not so. :-) Never heard of "net carbs"?
>
> I heard that Krispy Kreme complained about them (they lost money due to
> low carb diets).
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical...bohydrate_diet
> s
>
> Here is an overview of research spanning a century. You'd think that
> after such a long time there should be something stronger than "it
> appears". But there is none. Low carb diets seem to work a bit better
> for some people with diabetes and insulin response problems. A bit
> better.

That is probably why it works so well for me and many other obese
Americans. Insulin resistance is rampant...

The thing is, starchy and sugary carbs are more readily converted to
glucose than protein is. The body has to work harder to make glucose
from proteins, so protein is less efficient.

That is a good thing.
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

In article <1olph5-69d.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dnia 2008-06-07 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
> >>> Last question. Andrzej, I've discussed things with you on here a lot
> >>> in the past, and I really don't know how to pronounce Andrzej. Is
> >>> that
> >>> your name, or a handle? If it's your name, is it pronounced
> >>> and-er-ZEJ
> >>> (3 syllables, with the emphasis on the last syllable)?
> >>
> >> Unjay would be close enough for me. Two syllables. "rz" is one sound
> >> made
> >> up of two letters, like for example "sh" in English. Polish names
> >> read
> >> funny in English, but they sound fairly normal when you read them in
> >> Polish. Of course English names can be a total jawbreaker if you try
> >> to
> >> read them in Polish too.
> >
> > The usual English mispronunciation of this name is "Andre," as in Andre
> > the Giant.
>
> Fine too. Germans used to call me that. (But why would you assume that
> "as in Andre the Giant" could serve as a clarification for someone who
> probably never watched pro wrestling? I googled the guy, and am still
> smiling due this pan-Americanism. ;-))

Andre the giant was one of my favorite actors.

I mourned when he died. <sigh>

But those that suffer from pituitary gigantism don't generally live full
lives...
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

"Omelet" <ompomelet@gmail.com> wrote in message
newsmpomelet-B50206.12243207062008@news.giganews.com...
> In article <1olph5-69d.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
> Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Dnia 2008-06-07 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
>> >>> Last question. Andrzej, I've discussed things with you on here a
>> >>> lot
>> >>> in the past, and I really don't know how to pronounce Andrzej. Is
>> >>> that
>> >>> your name, or a handle? If it's your name, is it pronounced
>> >>> and-er-ZEJ
>> >>> (3 syllables, with the emphasis on the last syllable)?
>> >>
>> >> Unjay would be close enough for me. Two syllables. "rz" is one
>> >> sound
>> >> made
>> >> up of two letters, like for example "sh" in English. Polish names
>> >> read
>> >> funny in English, but they sound fairly normal when you read them
>> >> in
>> >> Polish. Of course English names can be a total jawbreaker if you
>> >> try
>> >> to
>> >> read them in Polish too.
>> >
>> > The usual English mispronunciation of this name is "Andre," as in
>> > Andre
>> > the Giant.
>>
>> Fine too. Germans used to call me that. (But why would you assume
>> that
>> "as in Andre the Giant" could serve as a clarification for someone
>> who
>> probably never watched pro wrestling? I googled the guy, and am
>> still
>> smiling due this pan-Americanism. ;-))
>
> Andre the giant was one of my favorite actors.

Exactly - I know nothing of pro wrestling. Here's a link to The
Princess Bride.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com


> I mourned when he died. <sigh>
>
> But those that suffer from pituitary gigantism don't generally live
> full
> lives...
> --
> Peace! Om
>
> "Human nature seems to be to control other people
> until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

Dnia 2008-06-07 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
> "Omelet" <ompomelet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> Andre the giant was one of my favorite actors.
>
> Exactly - I know nothing of pro wrestling. Here's a link to The
> Princess Bride.
>
> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/

I haven't seen this movie, and a pro wrestler was first to jump at me
from Google. I'll try to see it some time. Thanks for a tip.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

"Andrzej Rosa" <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e8erh5-oub.ln1@bakters.bandit.home...
> Dnia 2008-06-07 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
>> "Omelet" <ompomelet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>
>>> Andre the giant was one of my favorite actors.
>>
>> Exactly - I know nothing of pro wrestling. Here's a link to The
>> Princess Bride.
>>
>> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/
>
> I haven't seen this movie, and a pro wrestler was first to jump at me
> from Google. I'll try to see it some time. Thanks for a tip.

One of my all-time favorite movies. The trailer on the imdb site does
not, IMHO, do the movie justice. It's a must-see.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com


>
> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R

In article <6b027rF381o7uU1@mid.individual.net>,
"Steve Freides" <steve@fridayscomputer.com> wrote:

> > Andre the giant was one of my favorite actors.
>
> Exactly - I know nothing of pro wrestling. Here's a link to The
> Princess Bride.
>
> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/
>
> -S-
> http://www.kbnj.com

Yes, I have the Princess Bride. :-)
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

In article <e8erh5-oub.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dnia 2008-06-07 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
> > "Omelet" <ompomelet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >>
> >> Andre the giant was one of my favorite actors.
> >
> > Exactly - I know nothing of pro wrestling. Here's a link to The
> > Princess Bride.
> >
> > http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/
>
> I haven't seen this movie, and a pro wrestler was first to jump at me
> from Google. I'll try to see it some time. Thanks for a tip.

It's a classic. Semi-comedy...
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein

On Jun 4, 4:13 pm, Jason Carlton <jwcarl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Guys, I've really become very discouraged with losing fat. I've taken
> all of the advice I can for a year and a half now, but really see very
> little difference.
>
> The weight lifting is great. I can bench over 400lbs, and can squat
> over 600. My bulk is great, my shoulders and legs look awesome, and my
> calves are my new favorite body part! I've never had division there
> before, so this is pretty cool.
>
> But my problem area is my midsection. My waist is 34", and my
> midsection (around the belly button) is 39". I can see a faint outline
> of abs along the sides and upper part of my abs, but just fat at the
> lower part and obliques. This is the exact same measurement that I had
> a year and a half ago, so if I've lost any fat at all, the measuring
> tape doesn't show it.
>
> I've posted before, and the advice is generally "get your diet under
> control." That's just it, though; I don't see how I could get it more
> under control!
>
> Here's an average day for me:
>
> Breakfast: whole wheat cereal with 2% milk. On weekends I switch this
> to an omelet (eggs, cheese, peppers, maybe some diced ham).
>
> Lunch: turkey or chicken breast sandwich on whole wheat bread, with
> lettuce and maybe tomato. For a side, I typically do something with
> sweet potatoes for fiber.
>
> Post Lunch: I've taken a liking to the South Beach diet bars. They
> have around 150 calories, 11g of protein, and low sugar.
>
> Dinner: 8oz chicken breast or tuna steak, whole grain rice, maybe
> asparagus or corn. Sometimes I add low-sodium cream of chicken soup to
> the rice for flavor, and the chicken is grilled unless it's raining
> outside.
>
> After Dinner / Pre Workout: a bowl of cooked oatmeal, sometimes with a
> scoop of protein added in or cooked with soy milk.
>
> I drink 4-5 bottles of water (24 oz) per day, and usually drink
> unsweetened tea with meals. I might drink a Coke Zero on weekends, but
> we're talking 4-6 cans a month.
>
> On weekends, I might do a steak or pasta, just to keep my taste buds
> alive. And maybe once a month I'll have a few friends over, and we'll
> drink a couple of martinis; still, we're talking 2 or 3 a month.
>
> I take a protein supplement before and after working out (the Pro
> SLAMM shots), glutamine, and creatine. I also take a multivitamin and
> Lysine (to prevent cold sores; nothing to do with lifting), and I
> might drink another protein shake 30 minutes or so after the workout
> if my protein is low that day. I've been using thermogenics (coral
> calcium and green tea) for about a year, but stopped recently when I
> felt like they had no impact. I also take chromium, but was planning
> to drop it when I run out, for the same reason (don't see a
> difference).
>
> I've completely removed regular soda from my diet (I used to drink 3-4
> a day), anything that says enriched (white bread, rice, etc), and have
> lowered my sodium substantially. I've always eaten a lot of chicken,
> but before I started lifting, my dinner would be more like a chicken
> breast, mashed potatoes, macaroni & cheese, and 2-3 biscuits or rolls.
> So what I'm doing now is a pretty big difference.
>
> For about a year, I simply did heavy lifting and watched my food
> intake as above. About 4 months ago, though, I realized that there had
> been no change in my belly, so I cut out a lot of the smaller
> exercises (bench flyes, calf press, curls, lat bar, etc), and instead
> added 45 minutes of treadmill to my routine, so I'm doing cardio 4
> days a week. On the treadmill, I discovered that my endurance was for
> crap, so I'm building it up slowly using the Fartlek method (on an
> incline of 5, I'll run at 6mph for 1/4 mile, then power walk at 4mph
> for 1/4 mile, then run again, then walk again; I do this for 45
> minutes, which is about 3 miles).
>
> I figured that the cardio would really make a difference, but after 4
> months I'm the exact same measurement at the midsection as before:
> 39". About 10 years ago (before I hurt my hand and took a break from
> lifting), my chest was the same that it is now (46"), my legs were the
> same (28"), but my waist was 32". I also weighed around 155, where now
> I'm at 185.
>
> So, what gives? On paper, it seems like I'm doing everything right,
> but everything says you should start to see results in 2-3 months; not
> 2-3 years!

Try and become more positive...when u go work out...give yourself
positive feed back...let yourself known that what your doing is paying
off, its a mind game. Oh and cut 250-500 cals from diet and your good
to go! Keep up the great work...and nice stats on the bench/squat but
how much can u deadlift?

Omelet <ompomelet@gmail.com> writes:

> In article <e8erh5-oub.ln1@bakters.bandit.home>,
> Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Dnia 2008-06-07 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
>> > "Omelet" <ompomelet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >>
>> >> Andre the giant was one of my favorite actors.
>> >
>> > Exactly - I know nothing of pro wrestling. Here's a link to The
>> > Princess Bride.
>> >
>> > http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/
>>
>> I haven't seen this movie, and a pro wrestler was first to jump at me
>> from Google. I'll try to see it some time. Thanks for a tip.
>
> It's a classic. Semi-comedy...

Agreed, if you haven't seen _The Princess Bride_ you should. It's got
sword fighting, torture, miracles, pirates, and a whole pile more.

Jason

On Jun 4, 8:03 pm, "ATP*" <waxwingsl...@azurepane.com> wrote:
> "Jason Carlton" <jwcarl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:87e7a5e1-e7bf-4119-bd00-439b85a2bf53@m73g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > Guys, I've really become very discouraged with losing fat. I've taken
> > all of the advice I can for a year and a half now, but really see very
> > little difference.
>
> > The weight lifting is great. I can bench over 400lbs, and can squat
> > over 600. My bulk is great, my shoulders and legs look awesome, and my
> > calves are my new favorite body part! I've never had division there
> > before, so this is pretty cool.
>
> > But my problem area is my midsection. My waist is 34", and my
> > midsection (around the belly button) is 39". I can see a faint outline
> > of abs along the sides and upper part of my abs, but just fat at the
> > lower part and obliques. This is the exact same measurement that I had
> > a year and a half ago, so if I've lost any fat at all, the measuring
> > tape doesn't show it.
>
> > I've posted before, and the advice is generally "get your diet under
> > control." That's just it, though; I don't see how I could get it more
> > under control!
>
> > Here's an average day for me:
>
> > Breakfast: whole wheat cereal with 2% milk. On weekends I switch this
> > to an omelet (eggs, cheese, peppers, maybe some diced ham).
>
> > Lunch: turkey or chicken breast sandwich on whole wheat bread, with
> > lettuce and maybe tomato. For a side, I typically do something with
> > sweet potatoes for fiber.
>
> > Post Lunch: I've taken a liking to the South Beach diet bars. They
> > have around 150 calories, 11g of protein, and low sugar.
>
> > Dinner: 8oz chicken breast or tuna steak, whole grain rice, maybe
> > asparagus or corn. Sometimes I add low-sodium cream of chicken soup to
> > the rice for flavor, and the chicken is grilled unless it's raining
> > outside.
>
> > After Dinner / Pre Workout: a bowl of cooked oatmeal, sometimes with a
> > scoop of protein added in or cooked with soy milk.
>
> > I drink 4-5 bottles of water (24 oz) per day, and usually drink
> > unsweetened tea with meals. I might drink a Coke Zero on weekends, but
> > we're talking 4-6 cans a month.
>
> > On weekends, I might do a steak or pasta, just to keep my taste buds
> > alive. And maybe once a month I'll have a few friends over, and we'll
> > drink a couple of martinis; still, we're talking 2 or 3 a month.
>
> > I take a protein supplement before and after working out (the Pro
> > SLAMM shots), glutamine, and creatine. I also take a multivitamin and
> > Lysine (to prevent cold sores; nothing to do with lifting), and I
> > might drink another protein shake 30 minutes or so after the workout
> > if my protein is low that day. I've been using thermogenics (coral
> > calcium and green tea) for about a year, but stopped recently when I
> > felt like they had no impact. I also take chromium, but was planning
> > to drop it when I run out, for the same reason (don't see a
> > difference).
>
> > I've completely removed regular soda from my diet (I used to drink 3-4
> > a day), anything that says enriched (white bread, rice, etc), and have
> > lowered my sodium substantially. I've always eaten a lot of chicken,
> > but before I started lifting, my dinner would be more like a chicken
> > breast, mashed potatoes, macaroni & cheese, and 2-3 biscuits or rolls.
> > So what I'm doing now is a pretty big difference.
>
> > For about a year, I simply did heavy lifting and watched my food
> > intake as above. About 4 months ago, though, I realized that there had
> > been no change in my belly, so I cut out a lot of the smaller
> > exercises (bench flyes, calf press, curls, lat bar, etc), and instead
> > added 45 minutes of treadmill to my routine, so I'm doing cardio 4
> > days a week. On the treadmill, I discovered that my endurance was for
> > crap, so I'm building it up slowly using the Fartlek method (on an
> > incline of 5, I'll run at 6mph for 1/4 mile, then power walk at 4mph
> > for 1/4 mile, then run again, then walk again; I do this for 45
> > minutes, which is about 3 miles).
>
> > I figured that the cardio would really make a difference, but after 4
> > months I'm the exact same measurement at the midsection as before:
> > 39". About 10 years ago (before I hurt my hand and took a break from
> > lifting), my chest was the same that it is now (46"), my legs were the
> > same (28"), but my waist was 32". I also weighed around 155, where now
> > I'm at 185.
>
> > So, what gives? On paper, it seems like I'm doing everything right,
> > but everything says you should start to see results in 2-3 months; not
> > 2-3 years!
>
> Try this: 1/2 container of egg beaters with 3 slices of fat free cheese, a
> few slices of turkey bacon for breakfast, salad with vegetables, chicken and
> a low carb dressing for lunch, a few apples mixed in during the day, a
> relatively low carb dinner and a small amount of carbs sometime in the
> evening to take the edge off. Drop the protein shakes and also try
> intermittent fasting.
>
> Check out Lyle McDonald's stuff and also Art Devaney's Evolutionary Fitness
> (some of which is out there, but a lot of good advice if you're looking to
> get lean.

Jason I have the answer for you. I lost 25 lbs in 60 days and it was
easy. I got a Take Shape for life health coach and she designed a
nutrition program for me and in less than 45 days I could see my abbs
with no exersize. you can see my video here http://www.lose5lbsaweek.blogspot.com
or call me I will hook you up. 503-516-8457 you will be able to lose
that midsection like I did in no time Easy

Jason,
First let me say this, I dont know you and I dont know your
knowledge of bodybuilding and nutrition...but...With all do respect to
you and everyone who posted to your question...I have to say...most are
telling you all the wrong things...There are a few things I would of
liked to of known about you before I posted this, ike your age, height,
weight...etc... but since I dont I will make a generalization...
I, like you have had the same problem with my midsection when it
comes to getting those lower abs and obliques...it is a real pain in the
ass when you are not blessed with the genes some of the people have...
A little about me, I am 39, 5 foot 8 inches tall, 231 lbs and 13 %
body fat. I have been an avid gym goer since I was in highschool. While
in the Air Force I was on the base lifting team and one day going for my
best weight I tore my right pec which stopped me from lifting for years.
When I started again it was hard to get past that thought of my muscle
tearing and the pain that came with it so I really never got back into
lifting heavy again...as they say weight lifting is a menatl sport. I
started getting serious again about 8 years ago and although I have yet
to hit that magical bench press weight again I feel I am in better
condition and form then when before I got the injury.
I am assuming since you have those great stats of your bench and
squat that you are relatively a gym rat and that comes to my first
point...
When you said what you normally eat you gave 4 times of the day you
eat with other times of taking protein shakes...If you go to the gym as
much as I am guessing then you have to eat and eat a lot to maintain
what you have...not to mention to keep building....UNLESS you are
planning on competing anytime soon on the stage where your body fat has
to almost nil...then FORGET about lowering your calories...
I am again assuming you are pretty thick so your body needs what
you give it...the problem is that your body has adjusted to what you are
giving it and your metabolism has slowed to a crawl...you need to boost
your metabolism by not eating more...but by eating more times during the
day...when your body realizes that it can burn more because it will be
getting more later then it will be easier to burn off those last few
stubborn pounds...
If you go to any of the professional body builders websites and see
what a daily meal rotation is you will quickly realize that 4 times a
day is not sufficient. I was lucky enough to be flying from jersey to
las vegas and happened to meet and talk a lot to jay cutler last
year...Without getting personal with him he gave me a lot of pointers
about many things, especially nutrition...I have to tell you this in the
less than 5 hour flight he ate 3 separate times and had 2 protein
shakes...granted he is in a class all his own...and needs all that...but
you have to remember your body does what it needs to do to survive...Jay
layed out his daily food intake for me and he eats 16 yes sixteen times
a day...yes that also does include protein shakes...loads and loads of
protein...
So, Jason, before you lower your intake anymore try to up the
times of day you eat to kick start your metabolism and see if that works
for you...also with regards to your protein shake...you can also find
"LIGHT" shakes, muscle milk makes a great one...
If you take the advice of those who posted here...and again to
everyone with all do respect...but if you lower you caloric intake your
metabolism will slow even more...
Also, dont worry so much about what you are eating (unless again
you are going to compete) as much as how much of it you are eating at
any ONE time...you need carbs if you are working out, granted there are
better sources of carbs then others...but you need the quick energy
especially before a gym session...and also dont forget to eat quickly
after you wake up to get that body and metabolism moving...
I dont remember who posted it...but if you are body building NEVER
NEVER fast...they call it building for a reason and if you fast you are
depriving your body of what it needs...fuel...and if you dont give the
body the fuel it will find it other places...although fasting has its
perks, cleaning out the system, it will jump start your metabolism...but
to a point just as if you go on the atkins diet and stop eating carbs
completely you will loose weight but as soon as you start eating them
again...BAM there the weight comes right back...If you want to fast do
it a week when you are not planning on being in the gym much, maybe
during summer vacation...
Now granted will all that I said, we all realize for us to eat
numerous times a day can be an amazing chore not to mention a strain on
the old wallet...but if you think ahead and plan your meals out it isnt
that hard...I usually go grocery shopping on saturday and cook and
prepare all my meals on sunday for the that week...
Also dont forget just as with your workouts it is important to
change your routine around to shock your muscles so they dont get use to
same routine which slows your growth...so with that change your meals
around also...if your body gets use to a certain intake at a certain
time then it will conform to that and all will be lost again...
Lastly, there are plently of "enhancers" you can take that will
help you with that fat burning also...just a matter of getting your
hands on some...if you are willing...I am sure if you are in the gym as
much as I think you are you wont have any problem learning of what they
are...sorry I wont promote it so dont ask...

Oh yes and I forgot to mention you could also try 2 adays....hence
working out twice a day if that is possible for you...if not then do
your cardio in the morning and work out later that evening or vice
versa...I dont remember when you said you did your cardio so if I you
split it then cudos to you...