Herbal Supplements Aren't Always Healthy?

Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
not be aware of?"

Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
controversy...

This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
supplements... bad, so bad

(If interesting, full article:
http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)

Which bad herbal supplements do you know?

On 18 Mar, 08:50, "AleS" <sale...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
> not be aware of?"
>
> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
> controversy...
>
> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
> supplements... bad, so bad
>
> (If interesting, full article:http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...ents-arent-alw...)
>
> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?

So herbal supplements are similar to pills and supplements in general.

"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
> not be aware of?"
>
> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
> controversy...
>
> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
> supplements... bad, so bad
>
> (If interesting, full article:
> http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>
> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>

Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.

In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>
>"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googleg roups.com...
>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>> not be aware of?"
>>
>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>> controversy...
>>
>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>
>> (If interesting, full article:
>>
>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>
>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>
>Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.

Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.

Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.

You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.

Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher

"David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy.n et...
> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>
>>"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.google groups.com...
>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>>> not be aware of?"
>>>
>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>> controversy...
>>>
>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>
>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>
>>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>
>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>
>>Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>
> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>
> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>
> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>
> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>


Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
(prescription)
Are you really that ignorant????
Alternative, just a lying, scum troll from the pharm world.
Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
(prescription)

" Vernon" <stillhere@there> wrote:

>
>"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googleg roups.com...
>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>> not be aware of?"
>>
>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>> controversy...
>>
>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>
>> (If interesting, full article:
>> http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>
>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>
>
>Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>

Only by your definition.

Watta maroon!
--
Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
> not be aware of?"
>
> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
> controversy...
>
> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
> supplements... bad, so bad
>
> (If interesting, full article:
>
http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>
> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>


Nobody will spend very much money on researching herbs or supplements that
can't be patented.
Jamffer

In article <1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups .com>, "AleS"
<salex19@gmail.com> wrote:

> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,

Then you assumed wrong. You know what they say about assuming right?

> because herbs are a natural product.

Uranium is natural, you wanna eat it? Use your head.

>I there anyone this sAre there any side effects I may
> not be aware of?"

Depends. No general statements can be made from the above info. "Herbal"
can mean a million different things like asking "is this drug bad for me?"
without naming the drug.

>
> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
> controversy...

Ephedra is safe for most people as studies have shown. It's not for
everyone as it's a stimulant. People with some pre existing medical
conditions should avoid it.

--
Will @ www.BrinkZone.com

"It twas ever thus! " - Mr Natural

Ghamph wrote:
> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>> not be aware of?"
>>
>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>> controversy...
>>
>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>
>> (If interesting, full article:
>>
> http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>
>
>
> Nobody will spend very much money on researching herbs or supplements that
> can't be patented.
> Jamffer
>
>

If a company does spend money on research, they're criticized for
charging too much money for the herbs (never mind that all profits from
the company go for world peace projects like this one, since no-one
cares--they did marketing research, in fact--literally NO-ONE cares:
http://www.invincibleamerica.org/faq.html#scholarships)

consider Maharishi Amrit Kalash:


1: Inaba R, Mirbod SM, Sugiura H.
Effects of Maharishi Amrit Kalash 5 as an Ayurvedic herbal food
supplement on immune functions in aged mice.
BMC Complement Altern Med. 2005 Mar 25;5:8.

2: Dwivedi C, Agrawal P, Natarajan K, Sharma H.
Antioxidant and protective effects of Amrit Nectar tablets on
adriamycin- and cisplatin-induced toxicities.
J Altern Complement Med. 2005 Feb;11(1):143-8.

3: Rodella L, Borsani E, Rezzani R, Lanzi R, Lonati C, Bianchi R.
MAK-5 treatment enhances the nerve growth factor-mediated neurite
outgrowth in PC12 cells.
J Ethnopharmacol. 2004 Aug;93(2-3):161-6.

4: Vohra BP, James TJ, Sharma SP, Kansal VK, Chudhary A, Gupta SK.
Dark neurons in the ageing cerebellum: their mode of formation and
effect of Maharishi Amrit Kalash.
Biogerontology. 2002;3(6):347-54.

5: Vohra BP, Sharma SP, Kansal VK. Related Articles, Links
Maharishi Amrit Kalash, an ayurvedic medicinal preparation, enhances
cholinergic enzymes in aged guinea pig brain.
Indian J Exp Biol. 2001 Dec;39(12):1258-62.

6: Vohra BP, Sharma SP, Kansal VK. Related Articles, Links
Effect of Maharishi Amrit Kalash on age dependent variations in
mitochondrial antioxidant enzymes, lipid peroxidation and mitochondrial
population in different regions of the central nervous system of
guinea-pigs.
Drug Metabol Drug Interact. 2001;18(1):57-68.

7: Vohra BP, Sharma SP, Kansal VK, Gupta SK. Related Articles, Links
Effect of Maharishi Amrit Kalash an ayurvedic herbal mixture on lipid
peroxidation and neuronal lipofuscin accumulation in ageing guinea pig
brain.
Indian J Exp Biol. 2001 Apr;39(4):355-9.

8: Vohra BP, Sharma SP, Kansal VK. Related Articles, Links
Maharishi Amrit Kalash rejuvenates ageing central nervous system's
antioxidant defence system: an in vivo study.
Pharmacol Res. 1999 Dec;40(6):497-502.

9: Sundaram V, Hanna AN, Lubow GP, Koneru L, Falko JM, Sharma HM.
Related Articles, Links
Inhibition of low-density lipoprotein oxidation by oral herbal mixtures
Maharishi Amrit Kalash-4 and Maharishi Amrit Kalash-5 in hyperlipidemic
patients.
Am J Med Sci. 1997 Nov;314(5):303-10.

10: Cullen WJ, Dulchavsky SA, Devasagayam TP, Venkataraman BV, Dutta S.
Related Articles, Links
Effect of Maharishi AK-4 on H2O2-induced oxidative stress in isolated
rat hearts.
J Ethnopharmacol. 1997 May;56(3):215-22.

11: Lee JY, Hanna AN, Lott JA, Sharma HM.
The antioxidant and antiatherogenic effects of MAK-4 in WHHL rabbits.
J Altern Complement Med. 1996 Winter;2(4):463-78.

12: Inaba R, Sugiura H, Iwata H.
Immunomodulatory effects of Maharishi Amrit Kalash 4 and 5 in mice.
Nippon Eiseigaku Zasshi. 1995 Oct;50(4):901-5.

13: Lee JY, Lott JA, Sharma HM.
Biochemical changes induced by Maharishi Amrit Kalash (MAK-4) and
MA-208 in diet-induced hypercholesterolemic rabbits.
Adv Exp Med Biol. 1994;366:446-7. No abstract available.

14: Prasad ML, Parry P, Chan C.
Ayurvedic agents produce differential effects on murine and human
melanoma cells in vitro.
Nutr Cancer. 1993;20(1):79-86.

15: Sharma HM, Hanna AN, Kauffman EM, Newman HA.
Inhibition of human low-density lipoprotein oxidation in vitro by
Maharishi Ayur-Veda herbal mixtures.
Pharmacol Biochem Behav. 1992 Dec;43(4):1175-82.

16: Prasad KN, Edwards-Prasad J, Kentroti S, Brodie C, Vernadakis A.
Ayurvedic (science of life) agents induce differentiation in murine
neuroblastoma cells in culture.
Neuropharmacology. 1992 Jun;31(6):599-607.

17: Gelderloos P, Ahlstrom HH, Orme-Johnson DW, Robinson DK, Wallace RK,
Glaser JL.
Influence of a Maharishi Ayur-vedic herbal preparation on age-related
visual discrimination.
Int J Psychosom. 1990;37(1-4):25-9.

"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...

> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
> not be aware of?"

GMO herbal supplements are surely dangerous.

"Lawson English" <LawsonE@nowhere.none> wrote in message
news:RQhLh.1051$s8.736@newsfe21.lga...
> Ghamph wrote:
>> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>>> not be aware of?"
>>>
>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>> controversy...
>>>
>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>
>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>
>> http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>
>>
>>
>> Nobody will spend very much money on researching herbs or supplements
>> that
>> can't be patented.
>> Jamffer
>>
>>
>
> If a company does spend money on research, they're criticized for charging
> too much money for the herbs (never mind that all profits from the company
> go for world peace projects like this one, since no-one cares--they did
> marketing research, in fact--literally NO-ONE cares:

Hundreds of millions of hours over years have been spent.
Name a price per hour.

"Xenayo" <xenayo@xenayo.com> wrote:

>
>"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googleg roups.com...
>
>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>> not be aware of?"
>
>GMO herbal supplements are surely dangerous.
>

Why?
--
Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>
>"David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy. net...
>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>
>>>"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googl egroups.com...
>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>>>> not be aware of?"
>>>>
>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>>> controversy...
>>>>
>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>>
>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>>
>>>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>>
>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>>
>>>Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>>
>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>>
>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>>
>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>>
>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>>
>Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
>(prescription)
>Are you really that ignorant????

The ignorance is yours, Vernon. You just keep trying to cover it up.
YOU made the claim. YOU get to back it up. Demonstrate to us that
all prescription drugs are controlled because they are sooo
dangerous. Show us where the FDA says that.

You can't. You never will. You just keep blathering, assuring us we
should believe you because you're SUCH an expert.

This is your big chance, expert -- give us some references to back up
your claim.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher

On Mon, 19 Mar 2007, David Wright wrote:

> In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>
>> "David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>> news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy.n et...
>>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>>>>> not be aware of?"
>>>>>
>>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>>>> controversy...
>>>>>
>>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>>>
>>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>>>
>>>> http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>>>
>>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>>>
>>>> Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>>>
>>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>>>
>>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
>>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>>>
>>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
>>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
>>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>>>
>>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
>>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>>>
>> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
>> (prescription)
>> Are you really that ignorant????
>
> The ignorance is yours, Vernon. You just keep trying to cover it up.
> YOU made the claim. YOU get to back it up. Demonstrate to us that
> all prescription drugs are controlled because they are sooo
> dangerous. Show us where the FDA says that.
>
> You can't. You never will. You just keep blathering, assuring us we
> should believe you because you're SUCH an expert.
>
> This is your big chance, expert -- give us some references to back up
> your claim.
>
> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
> These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
> "HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher
>

I think that Vernon is saying prescription drugs are dangerous by
definition because the drugs that are only available by prescription are
regulated this way by the government because they are dangerous. The logic
behind this is fundamentally flawed. A drug isn't necessarily dangerous
because the government says it is. Pharmaceutical companies often push for
their drug to be available only by prescription for reasons other than
safety. This applies to the US only, I don't know the regulations in other
world states.

Claiming that most prescription drugs are dangerous is probably not
controversial, but arguing that absolutely all of them are dangerous is
simply idiotic. Why listen to the opinion of an idiot?

--
Sir Jackery

In article <Pine.LNX.4.64.0703181851070.30389@pc15.cs.ucdavis .edu>,
Sir Jackery <roehrig@cs.ucdavis.edu> wrote:
>On Mon, 19 Mar 2007, David Wright wrote:
>
>> In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>
>>> "David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>>> news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy.n et...
>>>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>>>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>>>>>> not be aware of?"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>>>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>>>>> controversy...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>>>>
>>>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>>>>
>>>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
>>>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>>>>
>>>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
>>>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
>>>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>>>>
>>>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
>>>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>>>>
>>> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
>>> (prescription)
>>> Are you really that ignorant????
>>
>> The ignorance is yours, Vernon. You just keep trying to cover it up.
>> YOU made the claim. YOU get to back it up. Demonstrate to us that
>> all prescription drugs are controlled because they are sooo
>> dangerous. Show us where the FDA says that.
>>
>> You can't. You never will. You just keep blathering, assuring us we
>> should believe you because you're SUCH an expert.
>>
>> This is your big chance, expert -- give us some references to back up
>> your claim.
>
>I think that Vernon is saying prescription drugs are dangerous by
>definition because the drugs that are only available by prescription are
>regulated this way by the government because they are dangerous. The logic
>behind this is fundamentally flawed. A drug isn't necessarily dangerous
>because the government says it is. Pharmaceutical companies often push for
>their drug to be available only by prescription for reasons other than
>safety. This applies to the US only, I don't know the regulations in other
>world states.

Nor do I, but Vernon is making his claim about the US, so that's a
reasonable restriction on the discussion.

>Claiming that most prescription drugs are dangerous is probably not
>controversial, but arguing that absolutely all of them are dangerous is
>simply idiotic. Why listen to the opinion of an idiot?

Nothing wrong with listening to them -- I just wonder if anyone takes
his idiotic opinions seriously? Vernon always tries to sound very
authoritative. If you read him for a while, you discover that he
posts the most incredible variety of nonsense, some of it obvious,
some of it less so. This is not to say that everything he posts is
wrong (it's not), but a lot of it is, and there's no handy method of
sorting the occasional wheat from the majority chaff.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher

"Sir Jackery" <roehrig@cs.ucdavis.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.LNX.4.64.0703181851070.30389@pc15.cs.ucd avis.edu...
> On Mon, 19 Mar 2007, David Wright wrote:
>
>> In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>
>>> "David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>>> news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy.n et...
>>>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>>>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>>>>>> not be aware of?"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is without
>>>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>>>>> controversy...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>>>>
>>>>> http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>>>>
>>>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>>>>
>>>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
>>>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>>>>
>>>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
>>>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
>>>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>>>>
>>>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
>>>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>>>>
>>> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
>>> (prescription)
>>> Are you really that ignorant????
>>
>> The ignorance is yours, Vernon. You just keep trying to cover it up.
>> YOU made the claim. YOU get to back it up. Demonstrate to us that
>> all prescription drugs are controlled because they are sooo
>> dangerous. Show us where the FDA says that.
>>
>> You can't. You never will. You just keep blathering, assuring us we
>> should believe you because you're SUCH an expert.
>>
>> This is your big chance, expert -- give us some references to back up
>> your claim.
>>
>> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
>> These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
>> "HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher
>>
>
> I think that Vernon is saying prescription drugs are dangerous by
> definition because the drugs that are only available by prescription are
> regulated this way by the government because they are dangerous. The logic
> behind this is fundamentally flawed. A drug isn't necessarily dangerous
> because the government says it is.

More likely they are in no means safe (often) even when taken as directed.

>Pharmaceutical companies often push for their drug to be available only by
>prescription for reasons other than safety. This applies to the US only, I
>don't know the regulations in other world states.
>
> Claiming that most prescription drugs are dangerous is probably not
> controversial, but arguing that absolutely all of them are dangerous is
> simply idiotic. Why listen to the opinion of an idiot?

Argue with the FDA,
First get an education.
Second, if you don't like it get rid of the FDA. They are almost always
wrong.
They DEFINE certain drugs to be CONTROLLED because of DANGERS.

Now go get an education and see if that makes logical sense (to the FDA)

>
> --
> Sir Jackery

"David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:LhmLh.7392$JZ3.3323@newssvr13.news.prodigy.ne t...
> In article <Pine.LNX.4.64.0703181851070.30389@pc15.cs.ucdavis .edu>,
> Sir Jackery <roehrig@cs.ucdavis.edu> wrote:
>>On Mon, 19 Mar 2007, David Wright wrote:
>>
>>> In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> "David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy.n et...
>>>>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>>>>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>>>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>>>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I
>>>>>>> may
>>>>>>> not be aware of?"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is
>>>>>>> without
>>>>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>>>>>> controversy...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>>>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>>>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>>>>>
>>>>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>>>>>
>>>>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
>>>>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>>>>>
>>>>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
>>>>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
>>>>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>>>>>
>>>>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
>>>>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>>>>>
>>>> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
>>>> (prescription)
>>>> Are you really that ignorant????
>>>
>>> The ignorance is yours, Vernon. You just keep trying to cover it up.
>>> YOU made the claim. YOU get to back it up. Demonstrate to us that
>>> all prescription drugs are controlled because they are sooo
>>> dangerous. Show us where the FDA says that.
>>>
>>> You can't. You never will. You just keep blathering, assuring us we
>>> should believe you because you're SUCH an expert.
>>>
>>> This is your big chance, expert -- give us some references to back up
>>> your claim.
>>
>>I think that Vernon is saying prescription drugs are dangerous by
>>definition because the drugs that are only available by prescription are
>>regulated this way by the government because they are dangerous. The logic
>>behind this is fundamentally flawed. A drug isn't necessarily dangerous
>>because the government says it is. Pharmaceutical companies often push for
>>their drug to be available only by prescription for reasons other than
>>safety. This applies to the US only, I don't know the regulations in other
>>world states.
>
> Nor do I, but Vernon is making his claim about the US, so that's a
> reasonable restriction on the discussion.
>
>>Claiming that most prescription drugs are dangerous is probably not
>>controversial, but arguing that absolutely all of them are dangerous is
>>simply idiotic. Why listen to the opinion of an idiot?
>
> Nothing wrong with listening to them -- I just wonder if anyone takes
> his idiotic opinions seriously?

Opinion?
Get an education and ask an FDA official why some substances are
"CONTROLLED"
It's not MY opinion it is THEIR opinion and they RULE.

But then you have no desire for logic or truth, just your lying and trolling
without any remorse for your near criminal attitude.
Come to think of it, maybe I should look into what the FDA thinks of people
who claim what the FDA says to be lies. Hmmmm, inciting lawlessness?
Inciting illegal purchase or sales of "controlled, dangerous" drugs in the
face of the FDA? Interesting.

>Vernon always tries to sound very
> authoritative. If you read him for a while, you discover that he
> posts the most incredible variety of nonsense, some of it obvious,
> some of it less so. This is not to say that everything he posts is
> wrong (it's not), but a lot of it is, and there's no handy method of
> sorting the occasional wheat from the majority chaff.

ASK the FDA.


>
> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
> These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
> "HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher

" Vernon" <stillhere@there> wrote:

>
>"David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>news:LhmLh.7392$JZ3.3323@newssvr13.news.prodigy.n et...
>> In article <Pine.LNX.4.64.0703181851070.30389@pc15.cs.ucdavis .edu>,
>> Sir Jackery <roehrig@cs.ucdavis.edu> wrote:
>>>On Mon, 19 Mar 2007, David Wright wrote:
>>>
>>>> In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> "David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>>>>> news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy.n et...
>>>>>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>>>>>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>>>>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>>>>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I
>>>>>>>> may
>>>>>>>> not be aware of?"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is
>>>>>>>> without
>>>>>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>>>>>>> controversy...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>>>>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>>>>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
>>>>>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
>>>>>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
>>>>>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
>>>>>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
>>>>> (prescription)
>>>>> Are you really that ignorant????
>>>>
>>>> The ignorance is yours, Vernon. You just keep trying to cover it up.
>>>> YOU made the claim. YOU get to back it up. Demonstrate to us that
>>>> all prescription drugs are controlled because they are sooo
>>>> dangerous. Show us where the FDA says that.
>>>>
>>>> You can't. You never will. You just keep blathering, assuring us we
>>>> should believe you because you're SUCH an expert.
>>>>
>>>> This is your big chance, expert -- give us some references to back up
>>>> your claim.
>>>
>>>I think that Vernon is saying prescription drugs are dangerous by
>>>definition because the drugs that are only available by prescription are
>>>regulated this way by the government because they are dangerous. The logic
>>>behind this is fundamentally flawed. A drug isn't necessarily dangerous
>>>because the government says it is. Pharmaceutical companies often push for
>>>their drug to be available only by prescription for reasons other than
>>>safety. This applies to the US only, I don't know the regulations in other
>>>world states.
>>
>> Nor do I, but Vernon is making his claim about the US, so that's a
>> reasonable restriction on the discussion.
>>
>>>Claiming that most prescription drugs are dangerous is probably not
>>>controversial, but arguing that absolutely all of them are dangerous is
>>>simply idiotic. Why listen to the opinion of an idiot?
>>
>> Nothing wrong with listening to them -- I just wonder if anyone takes
>> his idiotic opinions seriously?
>
>Opinion?
>Get an education and ask an FDA official why some substances are
>"CONTROLLED"
>It's not MY opinion it is THEIR opinion and they RULE.

Where can we read this rule?

And while we at it, when are you going to explain to me why I can only
buy metformin on prescription but I can buy unlimited quantities of
acetaminophen over the counter? There is no known dangerous dose of
metformin (the person who took 800 tablets in one go just got a severe
case of the trots) but paracetamol is the suicide drug of choice for
adolescents, with 50 tablets capable of causing the need for a liver
transplant.

I have both drugs in my home, and I have asked you to explain this
anomaly before.

>
>But then you have no desire for logic or truth, just your lying and trolling
>without any remorse for your near criminal attitude.
>Come to think of it, maybe I should look into what the FDA thinks of people
>who claim what the FDA says to be lies. Hmmmm, inciting lawlessness?
>Inciting illegal purchase or sales of "controlled, dangerous" drugs in the
>face of the FDA? Interesting.
>
>>Vernon always tries to sound very
>> authoritative. If you read him for a while, you discover that he
>> posts the most incredible variety of nonsense, some of it obvious,
>> some of it less so. This is not to say that everything he posts is
>> wrong (it's not), but a lot of it is, and there's no handy method of
>> sorting the occasional wheat from the majority chaff.
>
>ASK the FDA.
>
>
>>
>> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
>> These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
>> "HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher
>
--
Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

In article <45fe07ef$0$8372$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>
>"David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>news:LhmLh.7392$JZ3.3323@newssvr13.news.prodigy.n et...
>> In article <Pine.LNX.4.64.0703181851070.30389@pc15.cs.ucdavis .edu>,
>> Sir Jackery <roehrig@cs.ucdavis.edu> wrote:
>>>On Mon, 19 Mar 2007, David Wright wrote:
>>>
>>>> In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> "David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
>>>>> news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prodigy.n et...
>>>>>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0bbb@news.ThunderNews.com>,
>>>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.googlegr oups.com...
>>>>>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>>>>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>>>>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I
>>>>>>>> may
>>>>>>>> not be aware of?"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is
>>>>>>>> without
>>>>>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
>>>>>>>> controversy...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effects and
>>>>>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
>>>>>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...s-healthy.html)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
>>>>>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
>>>>>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
>>>>>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
>>>>>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
>>>>> (prescription)
>>>>> Are you really that ignorant????
>>>>
>>>> The ignorance is yours, Vernon. You just keep trying to cover it up.
>>>> YOU made the claim. YOU get to back it up. Demonstrate to us that
>>>> all prescription drugs are controlled because they are sooo
>>>> dangerous. Show us where the FDA says that.
>>>>
>>>> You can't. You never will. You just keep blathering, assuring us we
>>>> should believe you because you're SUCH an expert.
>>>>
>>>> This is your big chance, expert -- give us some references to back up
>>>> your claim.
>>>
>>>I think that Vernon is saying prescription drugs are dangerous by
>>>definition because the drugs that are only available by prescription are
>>>regulated this way by the government because they are dangerous. The logic
>>>behind this is fundamentally flawed. A drug isn't necessarily dangerous
>>>because the government says it is. Pharmaceutical companies often push for
>>>their drug to be available only by prescription for reasons other than
>>>safety. This applies to the US only, I don't know the regulations in other
>>>world states.
>>
>> Nor do I, but Vernon is making his claim about the US, so that's a
>> reasonable restriction on the discussion.
>>
>>>Claiming that most prescription drugs are dangerous is probably not
>>>controversial, but arguing that absolutely all of them are dangerous is
>>>simply idiotic. Why listen to the opinion of an idiot?
>>
>> Nothing wrong with listening to them -- I just wonder if anyone takes
>> his idiotic opinions seriously?
>
>Opinion?
>Get an education and ask an FDA official why some substances are
>"CONTROLLED"
>It's not MY opinion it is THEIR opinion and they RULE.

So you keep saying. As is invariably the case with you, we are
supposed to accept your unsupported opinion, inasmuch as you never
cite any sources.

Get an education yourself, Vernon. Find out what "because Vernon says
so" does not constitute evidence.

>But then you have no desire for logic or truth, just your lying and
>trolling without any remorse for your near criminal attitude.

Oh, here we go. When the nutballs like Vernon meet any opposition, or
anyone who refuses to instantly accept them as An Authority, they fly
into a rage and start making accusations.

>Come to think of it, maybe I should look into what the FDA thinks of people
>who claim what the FDA says to be lies. Hmmmm, inciting lawlessness?
>Inciting illegal purchase or sales of "controlled, dangerous" drugs in the
>face of the FDA? Interesting.

Interesting that you would make that up out of whole cloth and imply
it has something to do with me.

I've got news for you, Vernon: calling you a fool and an ignoramus
does not constitute any sort of incitement. You couldn't even sue me
for libel, because you ARE a fool and an ignoramus, and one who
carefully stays anonymous -- so as to make it harder to disprove your
many grandiose claims about your supposed career.

I'm not asking the FDA, Vernon, you pompous fraud, I'm asking YOU --
because you're the one making the claims. As usual, you can't back
them up.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"HPV shots don't cause promiscuity. Tequila shots do." -- Bill Maher

" Vernon" <stillhere@there>
> "David Wright" <wright@l1000.prodigy.net>

> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
> (prescription)

It bothers me to answer a question with another one.

Given that there are different levels of control:

Why is marijuana far more controlled than nicotine or alcohol? That's
pretty rhetorical. But, you must admit, drug control classifications have
more to do with perception of abuse than safety for the informed user.

m

"Peter Bowditch" <myfirstname@ratbags.com> wrote in message
news:ubirv25pbfa6lgikc39k3pndp4437vk8mb@4ax.com...
> "Xenayo" <xenayo@xenayo.com> wrote:

>>"AleS" <salex19@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.google groups.com...

>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help give my
>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I may
>>> not be aware of?"

>>GMO herbal supplements are surely dangerous.

> Why?

Every GMO used for food is dangerous.
Mother Nature is far more wiser, than 10 to 15 yeras of scientific research.

On 19 Mar, 04:59, Peter Bowditch <myfirstn...@ratbags.com> wrote:
> " Vernon" <stillhere@there> wrote:
>
> >"David Wright" <wri...@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
> >news:LhmLh.7392$JZ3.3323@newssvr13.news.prodigy.n et...
> >> In article <Pine.LNX.4.64.0703181851070.30...@pc15.cs.ucdavis .edu>,
> >> Sir Jackery <roeh...@cs.ucdavis.edu> wrote:
> >>>On Mon, 19 Mar 2007, David Wright wrote:
>
> >>>> In article <45fd9460$0$8336$882e0...@news.ThunderNews.com>,
> >>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>
> >>>>> "David Wright" <wri...@l1000.prodigy.net> wrote in message
> >>>>>news:iDfLh.10891$jx3.7848@newssvr25.news.prod igy.net...
> >>>>>> In article <45fd4624$0$8335$882e0...@news.ThunderNews.com>,
> >>>>>> Vernon <stillhere@there> wrote:
>
> >>>>>>> "AleS" <sale...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >>>>>>>news:1174204234.620917.246530@e65g2000hsc.g ooglegroups.com...
> >>>>>>>> Oops... "I regularly try various herbal supplements to help givemy
> >>>>>>>> health a boost and as a dieting tool. I've always assumed it's safe,
> >>>>>>>> because herbs are a natural product. Are there any side effects I
> >>>>>>>> may
> >>>>>>>> not be aware of?"
>
> >>>>>>>> Just because something is found in nature does not mean it is
> >>>>>>>> without
> >>>>>>>> risk. For instance, you've probably heard of the ephedra
> >>>>>>>> controversy...
>
> >>>>>>>> This product was also linked to a number of serious side effectsand
> >>>>>>>> deaths. In 2004, the FDA banned the sale of ephedra-containing
> >>>>>>>> supplements... bad, so bad
>
> >>>>>>>> (If interesting, full article:
>
> >>>http://herbalnature.blogspot.com/200...ents-arent-alw....)
>
> >>>>>>>> Which bad herbal supplements do you know?
>
> >>>>>>> Whereas; Prescription drugs are "ALWAYS" "DANGEROUS", by definition.
>
> >>>>>> Whereas, Vernon keeps saying this -- without evidence.
>
> >>>>>> Give us the evidence, Vernon -- show us the URL on the FDA web site
> >>>>>> where it says that prescription drugs are always dangerous.
>
> >>>>>> You won't be able to do so, because prescription drugs are not always
> >>>>>> dangerous. Some of them are quite innocuous, and many OTC items are
> >>>>>> much more dangerous than some prescription drugs.
>
> >>>>>> Oh, well -- it's been obvious from the outset that Vernon, the self-
> >>>>>> professed expert on everything, has been making it up as he goes.
>
> >>>>> Please explain (ask your guru or mother) why are the drugs "controlled"
> >>>>&g