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  #1  
Old 07-19-2008, 11:30 AM
Taka
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Default More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
substrate in the form of Arginine. IMHO this formula should also work
for great erections ...

From the full text at http://www.myonet.com/p-AX12.htm :

"Nitric Oxide is a byproduct of Arginine being broken down in the body
by an enzyme called Nitric Oxide Synthase (NOS). Your body only has a
limited supply of NOS. Consequently, no matter how much Arginine you
have flooded your system with, your NO will only be as high as the
amount of NOS you have to break it down. We have a breakthrough way to
create more of the key enzyme, NOS. The resultRIDICULOUS PUMPS! We
are talking pumps so big, they almost hurt. Excited yet?

How in the heck to did you do this? You might ask. The answer is the
addition of a compound called Arachidonic Acid (AA). You may have seen
AA in other products because it has so many benefits. But you have
never seen it used this way before. AA has the ability to turn on
(upregulate) NOS through a complex process. Once AA is released from
the phospholipid layer of each muscle cell during exercise, it is
rapidly converted to prostaglandins (PGE2). PGE2 upregulates the
enzyme NOS creating the perfect environment for MASS Nitric Oxide
production."

"Arachidonic Acid
HemodrauliX is the first nitric oxide product ever to harness the
power of Arachidonic Acid (AA). The powerful combo of AA and NO work
together to ignite a cascading process that leads to pumps and
endurance never before experienced by the bodybuilding and athletic
world. Arachidonic Acid is the precursor to cell-signaling molecules
called prostaglandins (PGE2). In addition to being highly anabolic,
PGE2 works with Nitric Oxide to create massive vasodialation, feeding
the muscles by increasing blood flow, oxygen and assisting with
glucose uptake. Youve heard supplement companies promise skin-
bursting pumps before. Now its time to actually experience them."


It seems to me that one way to suppress the production of the bad
destructive AA metabolites called leukotrienes is to involve in
resistance exercise. Could it be the excessive carbohydrates
(particularly fructose) not burned for energy which stimulate the bad
guys like LTB4??

Taka
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  #2  
Old 07-19-2008, 11:30 AM
Taka
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Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Just for a record - this is the original AA patent:

Use of arachidonic acid as a method of increasing skeletal muscle mass

United States Patent 6841573

This invention discloses a method of orally administering arachidonic
acid for the purpose of increasing the serum level of the
prostaglandin PGF2alpha and subsequently the level of retained
skeletal muscle mass.

A method for increasing muscle mass, which method comprises
administering orally to a human in need of such treatment an amount of
arachidonic acid between about 100 mg and 5,500 mg which is effective
in raising the level of the endogenous prostaglandin PGF2 alpha.

BACKGROUND OF THE INVENTION

Maintaining a healthy level of muscle mass can play an important role
in sustaining overall good health, with benefits such as increased
basal metabolic rate, better disposal of dietary fats and maintenance
of lower body fat levels, increased immune system health, and an
increase in one's overall vitality and sense of well-being compared to
maintaining lower than ideal levels of lean body mass. A number of
pathological conditions exist that make it difficult to maintain a
normal healthy level of muscle mass, including HIV (human
immunodeficiency virus), andropause or hypogonadism (subnormal
androgen levels), infection, trauma, burns, and spinal cord injury.
Some individuals also fail to gain or to maintain normal lean body
mass without definite pathophysiologic reasons. Many treatments are
offered that would help an individual in need of such treatment
promote the buildup of muscle tissue.

Skeletal muscle mass is increased or maintained in the body through a
number of separate and distinct mechanisms. Such mechanisms play a
role in the regulation of either skeletal muscle protein synthesis or
breakdown, and collectively control the total amount of accrued
protein present in the muscle cell. The actions of androgens are among
the most visibly tied to the regulation of skeletal muscle mass, as
these hormones are collectively responsible for the development and
maintenance of male sexual characteristics including external
virilization, sexual maturity at puberty, spermatogenesis, sexual
behavior/libido and erectile functioning and the support of bone and
muscle tissue growth. It is well documented in the prior art that
raising the level of androgenic hormones in the body can increase
skeletal muscle mass. A number of methods have similarly been
developed to increase the level of androgenic hormones in the body,
which ultimately can be used to offer the benefits of increased
skeletal muscle mass in humans.

In searching for ways to increase androgen levels in the body, the use
of androgen precursor hormones have been suggested. U.S. Pat. No.
5,578,588 to Mattem et al. relates a method of using a precursor
hormone, namely androstenedione, as a means of increasing testosterone
levels. Although the in-vivo conversion of endogenous androstenedione
to testosterone had been documented and cited in this patent, the use
of this compound as an external supplement for producing a stable and
effective increase in serum testosterone had never been investigated
before, and therefore represents a novel invention. The
pharmacokinetics of administering such a precursor is such that
hormone concentrations of active hormone (testosterone) peak within 90
minutes, and subsequently decline over a period of three to four
hours. This more closely resembles the natural pulsating pattern in
which the body releases testosterone, and avoids the prolonged peaks
and troughs noted with use of esterified injectable hormone
preparations.

Several other methods of using different androgen precursor hormones
have also been disclosed, including U.S. Pat. No. 5,880,117 to Patrick
Arnold, which relates a method of using 4-androstenediol as a means of
increasing testosterone levels in humans. This in-vivo conversion of 4-
androstenediol to testosterone, again, was well documented in the
prior art and this patent, however the use of this compound as an
effective oral medicament for raising testosterone levels was never
investigated prior, and therefore represents another novel invention.
U.S. Pat. No. 6,391,868 to Arnold similarly relates a method of using
5-alpha-androst-1-en-3-one for increasing levels of the anabolic/
androgenic steroid 17-beta-hydroxy-5-alpha-androst-1-en-3-one in
humans. Again the in-vivo bioconversion was known, however a formal
investigation of its oral use to increase serum androgen levels had
never been disclosed. U.S. Pat. No. 6,262,436 to Llewellyn further
discloses the method of using 5-alpha-androstanedione or 5-alpha-
androstanediol to increase levels of dihydrotestosterone in humans, a
hormone which also offers the benefit of regulating protein synthesis
and increasing skeletal muscle mass.

The use of androgenic hormones in general, however, is often thought
to entail some risk, as increasing the level of such hormones may also
be relevant to the development of undesirable side effects such as
gynecomastia, water retention (edema), unfavorable alterations in
cholesterol levels (increased heart disease risk) and increased blood
pressure to name just a few. If an individual is seeking solely to
increase skeletal muscle mass, and is not in need of androgen
replacement, then the methods regarding the use of androgen precursors
may be less than ideal. It therefore became to focus of this inventor
to find another distinct mechanism in the body that plays an important
role in the regulation of protein synthesis, and can be affected
externally by the similar use of a precursor compound to an active
constituent in said mechanism to enhance the buildup of skeletal
muscle tissue.

This invention relates a method of administering arachidonic acid for
the purpose of increasing the level of the prostaglandin PGF2alpha and
subsequently skeletal muscle mass. PGF2alpha is not an androgenic
steroid, but an endogenous prostaglandin. It is referred to commonly
as an inflammatory hormone, and is related to several biological
functions including immunity, response to allergens, intestinal
mobility and blood flow in various regions of the body. PGF2alpha is
also closely tied to skeletal muscle protein synthesis in the body
(Biochem J 1983 Sep. 15;214(3):1011-4), and represents an important
new target for the external modulation of skeletal muscle mass
distinct from the mechanisms involving male sex steroids. This method
of using arachidonic acid for increasing PGF2alpha and skeletal muscle
mass is an ideal solution for an individual in need of such treatment,
because PGF2alpha is non-steroidal, and can increase protein synthesis
and muscle mass without the potential undesirable side effects
associated with altering sex steroid levels with androgen precursor
hormones.

BRIEF SUMMARY OF THE INVENTION

Prior art relates several novel methods of using precursors to
hormones that regulate protein synthesis for the purpose of increasing
the levels of said hormones, which ultimately can increase skeletal
muscle mass. Although the suggested practice of using precursors to
physiologically active hormones seems quite sound, the target hormones
in the cited art, namely androgenic steroids, may be less than ideal
in many cases, particularly in those where increases in skeletal
muscle mass are desired but the potential side effects of androgens
contraindicates their use. The problem of the present invention is
therefore to provide a precursor to a target hormone that can also be
used to increase skeletal muscle mass when administered, but is
completely non-steroidal. According to the invention this problem is
solved by the oral use of arachidonic acid, a direct precursor to the
prostaglandin PGF2alpha. This method is ideal because it is natural,
non-toxic, quickly metabolized to active form after oral
administration, and can increase skeletal muscle mass without the
potential side effects of androgenic precursors.

DETAILED DESCRIPTION OF THE INVENTION

Arachidonic acid is a naturally occurring polyunsaturated fat,
belonging to the Omega-6 family of fatty acids. It is considered an
essential fatty acid (EFA), because it is an essential nutrient that
your body can't produce itself. The only way you can get arachidonic
acid is through the food you eat. It is obtained in small amounts in
the average human diet, coming from various plant and animal sources
including milk. Arachidonic acid has furthermore been identified as a
vital precursor to numerous hormones in the body including
prostaglandins, prostacyclin (PGI12), leukotrienes, and thromboxanes.

Studies by have fundamentally proven the in-vitro conversion of
arachidonic acid to the prostaglandin PGF2alpha. Experiments by Berlin
et al. (Acta Physiol Scand 1979 August;106(4):441-5) used 14C-labeled
arachidonic acid to chart the metabolism of this essential fatty acid
into various prostaglandins in human skeletal muscle and kidney
homogenates. Those prostaglandins produced during this incubation
include PGD2, PGE2, PGF2 alpha and 6-keto-PGF1 alpha. Further studies
with labeled arachidonic acid have fundamentally proven the in-vivo
conversion of this fatty acid into PGF2alpha (Acta Physiol Scand 1979
July;106(3):307-12). In this investigation the labeled metabolites of
arachidonic acid were measured in serum extracted from the forearm and
kidney of human volunteers after direct infusion into the brachial or
renal artery. PGD2, PGE2, PGF2 alpha, 6-keto-PGF1 alpha and 13,14-
dihydro-15-keto-PGE2 (Me) were all found in this experiment.

The prostaglandin PGF2alpha has also been proven to play a vital role
in skeletal muscle protein synthesis. In fact, it is one of the
prostaglandins most closely tied to protein synthesis, and therefore
the primary focus of this invention. Studies conducted by Smith et al.
(Biochem J 1983 July 15;214(1):153-61) have fundamentally proven the
importance of PGF2alpha in stimulating protein synthesis in-vitro, by
testing the effects of various arachidonic acid metabolites when
incubated with intact rabbit muscle that was intermittently placed
under stretch stimulus. In this study two prostaglandins, F2 alpha and
A1, increased rates of protein synthesis in unstimulated muscles, but
prostaglandins E2 and D2 and the leukotrienes C4 and D4 failed to do
so. Further studies with the cox-1 enzyme inhibitors ibuprofen and
acetaminophen, which exhibit their anti-inflammatory actions by
inhibiting the synthesis of prostaglandins, suggest that these drugs
can profoundly diminish the anabolic response of muscle to resistance
exercise by inhibiting the normal post-exercise increase in levels of
PGF2alpha (Clin Endocrinol Metab 2001 October;86(10):5067-7). A search
of the prior art does not reveal any investigations into what effect
additional arachidonic acid in the diet would have on total protein
synthesis or skeletal muscle mass.

Prior art also does not disclose any investigations regarding the
effect oral arachidonic acid would have on the serum level of
PGF2alpha. Human tests carried out by Kelley et al. (Lipids 1998
February:33(2):125-30), however, did look at the effect of oral
arachidonic acid on in-vitro immune response as measured by the
secretion of different prostaglandins and immune system factors. In
this study, the in-vitro secretion of LTB4 and PGE2, as demonstrated
by influenza antibody titers determined on drawn blood, did seem to
measurably increase after oral administration of 200 mg and 1.5 g of
supplemented arachidonic acid per day. This suggested to this inventor
that a similar increase might be noted in-vivo with other
prostaglandins not measured in this experiment including PGF2alpha.

After learning of the in-vitro and in-vivo conversion of arachidonic
acid to PGF2alpha, plus the role PGF2alpha plays in the regulation of
skeletal muscle protein synthesis, it became the focus of this
invention that skeletal muscle mass can be increased by the oral
administration of arachidonic acid. In an effort to prove this theory
a clinical study was therefore undertaken by the inventor.
Specifically, it was the intention of this inventor to prove that
arachidonic acid would act as an effective in-vivo peroral PGF2alpha
precursor in man capable of raising and sustaining elevated PGF2alpha
levels, and that the resultant increases in levels of PGF2alpha would
result in increases in the level of skeletal muscle mass.

An effective oral daily dosage of arachidonic acid is between 100 mg
to 5,500 mg. It is ideally provided as a soft gelatin capsule or oral
liquid, due to the fact that arachidonic acid is in the form of free
flowing oil at room temperature. Due to the rapidity in which the
discussed compound is metabolized in the body, the total daily dosage
can be further subdivided for a more sustained blood hormone
concentration, with 2-3 applications per day being most preferred.

SOURCE: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/6841573.html
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  #3  
Old 07-19-2008, 07:24 PM
Kofi
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

In article
<fb063f63-9d9b-4c03-b801-6d914b60931d@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>,
Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:

> This invention discloses a method of orally administering arachidonic
> acid for the purpose of increasing the serum level of the
> prostaglandin PGF2alpha and subsequently the level of retained
> skeletal muscle mass.


FYI, FGF2a stimulates IL-6 [PMID 11968002] - so you could have a guy who
has muscle wasting because he has Crohn's disease and too much IL-6 and
I bet some joker somewhere will read this patent and then try giving the
guy arachidonic acid.

Doh!

(You're also going to stimulate the development of colon cancer this
way.)
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  #4  
Old 07-19-2008, 07:24 PM
Kofi
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

In article
<43483d42-119f-4560-b91d-8eecacd4e8c3@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>,
Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:

> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
> substrate in the form of Arginine. IMHO this formula should also work
> for great erections ...
>
> From the full text at http://www.myonet.com/p-AX12.htm :
>
> "Nitric Oxide is a byproduct of Arginine being broken down in the body
> by an enzyme called Nitric Oxide Synthase (NOS). Your body only has a
> limited supply of NOS. Consequently, no matter how much Arginine you
> have flooded your system with, your NO will only be as high as the
> amount of NOS you have to break it down. We have a breakthrough way to
> create more of the key enzyme, NOS. The resultRIDICULOUS PUMPS! We
> are talking pumps so big, they almost hurt. Excited yet?
>
> How in the heck to did you do this? You might ask. The answer is the
> addition of a compound called Arachidonic Acid (AA). You may have seen
> AA in other products because it has so many benefits. But you have
> never seen it used this way before. AA has the ability to turn on
> (upregulate) NOS through a complex process. Once AA is released from
> the phospholipid layer of each muscle cell during exercise, it is
> rapidly converted to prostaglandins (PGE2). PGE2 upregulates the
> enzyme NOS creating the perfect environment for MASS Nitric Oxide
> production."
>
> "Arachidonic Acid
> HemodrauliX is the first nitric oxide product ever to harness the
> power of Arachidonic Acid (AA). The powerful combo of AA and NO work
> together to ignite a cascading process that leads to pumps and
> endurance never before experienced by the bodybuilding and athletic
> world. Arachidonic Acid is the precursor to cell-signaling molecules
> called prostaglandins (PGE2). In addition to being highly anabolic,
> PGE2 works with Nitric Oxide to create massive vasodialation, feeding
> the muscles by increasing blood flow, oxygen and assisting with
> glucose uptake. Youve heard supplement companies promise skin-
> bursting pumps before. Now its time to actually experience them."
>
>
> It seems to me that one way to suppress the production of the bad
> destructive AA metabolites called leukotrienes is to involve in
> resistance exercise. Could it be the excessive carbohydrates
> (particularly fructose) not burned for energy which stimulate the bad
> guys like LTB4??
>
> Taka


Looking strictly at the pathways, you could also get this effect taking
estrogen - it's an eNOS stimulant - but somehow, I don't think any of
these guys are going to try it. There's also citrulline, folic acid/BH4
and straight superoxide dismutase. Many of them have some real risks to
them (BH4 and Parkinson's, for instance). Frankly, fiddling along this
pathway for a little extra muscle is just plane stupid
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  #5  
Old 07-20-2008, 04:50 AM
DZ
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Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Kofi <kofi@anon.un.org> wrote:
> Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>> substrate in the form of Arginine. IMHO this formula should also work
>> for great erections ...

>
> Looking strictly at the pathways, you could also get this effect taking
> estrogen - it's an eNOS stimulant - but somehow, I don't think any of
> these guys are going to try it.


What "these guys" are you talking about? Those that just signed up for
the gym and ready to buy anything with a flashy name? General rule is
that if it works for athletic enhancement, then it is either a
prescription drug or something illegal. Even creatine, the only
supplement for which there is reasonable evidence that it may improve
strength (that may ultimatelyy add muscle mass with proper training)
could maybe add some 20 lb to your 405 lb bench press.
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  #6  
Old 07-20-2008, 04:14 PM
Taka
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Jul 20, 3:22 am, Kofi <k...@anon.un.org> wrote:
> In article
> <fb063f63-9d9b-4c03-b801-6d914b609...@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>,
>
> Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > This invention discloses a method of orally administering arachidonic
> > acid for the purpose of increasing the serum level of the
> > prostaglandin PGF2alpha and subsequently the level of retained
> > skeletal muscle mass.

>
> FYI, FGF2a stimulates IL-6 [PMID 11968002] - so you could have a guy who
> has muscle wasting because he has Crohn's disease and too much IL-6 and
> I bet some joker somewhere will read this patent and then try giving the
> guy arachidonic acid.
>
> Doh!
>
> (You're also going to stimulate the development of colon cancer this
> way.)


It seems to me that the serious bodybuilders could be well depleting
AA in the muscle cells quite efficiently by the strenuous training -
see my previous post entitled "Spaceflight muscle wasting" which shows
how any muscle use produces prostaglandins which are not going to turn
back into AA afterwards. When you reach a plateau in the muscle
growth you don't usually get the usual DOMS (delayed muscle pain/
soreness) anymore. Because DOMS are caused by the very AA metabolites
like PGF2a, PGE2 this may signal that there is not enough AA precursor
probably because not enough delta-5 desaturase is hanging around for
the great demand during intense trainings. So I suspect that in the
trained individuals any supplementary AA would be quickly soaked into
the muscle fibers without causing any systemic inflammatory problems.
Of course on the other hand it can cause a lot of damage to a
sedentary folk on an Omega-6 rich diet whose muscles are already
overloaded with AA to begin with.

Taka
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  #7  
Old 07-21-2008, 01:52 PM
Taka
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Another related thought is that when the top athletes quit the
training they often start feeling bad due to different inflammatory
problems such as aching joints because their desaturase system has
been conditioned for the high AA demand during intense muscle work and
they start getting excess of it in the absence of the exercise. Same
as the SNPs overactivating the delta-5 desaturase linked to vascular
diseases.

Taka
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  #8  
Old 07-22-2008, 01:45 PM
Tom Anderson
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:

> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
> Arachidonic Acid (AA).


That's in peanuts, right?

tom

--
And the evening and the morning were the fifth day.
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  #9  
Old 07-22-2008, 01:45 PM
Taka
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
> > The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
> > stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
> > substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
> > this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
> > Arachidonic Acid (AA).

>
> That's in peanuts, right?


No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.

Taka
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  #10  
Old 07-22-2008, 06:10 PM
Omelet
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Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

In article <Pine.LNX.4.64.0807221224040.11853@urchin.earth.li >,
Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> wrote:

> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>
> > The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
> > stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
> > substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
> > this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
> > Arachidonic Acid (AA).

>
> That's in peanuts, right?
>
> tom


Be careful with that. I recall some information on some other compound
in peanuts causing infertility in men.

Don't ask me for a cite. This is a memory dredged up from many moons
ago...
--
Peace! Om

"Human nature seems to be to control other people
until they put their foot down." -- Stephan Rothstein
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  #11  
Old 07-22-2008, 10:49 PM
DZ
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>> > The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>> > stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>> > substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>> > this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>> > Arachidonic Acid (AA).

>>
>> That's in peanuts, right?

>
> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.
> Taka


No, Taka, you don't understand.

Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
Oxford.

He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for peanuts.
Get it? Arachi-donic.
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  #12  
Old 07-23-2008, 12:00 AM
Tom Anderson
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Tue, 22 Jul 2008, DZ wrote:

> Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>>>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>>>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>>>> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>>>> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>>>> Arachidonic Acid (AA).
>>>
>>> That's in peanuts, right?

>>
>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high amounts
>> in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently mentioned
>> farmed salmon fed grains.

>
> No, Taka, you don't understand.
>
> Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
> Oxford.
>
> He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for peanuts.


Huh. And there was me thinking it was that planet out of those Dune books.

> Get it? Arachi-donic.


Actually, i kind of assumed because of the name that it really would be in
peanuts. After all, why would it get called arachidonic acid if it's not
found in _Arachis_? Maybe it is there, but in small quantities. That'd be
typical biochemist naming, actually. I bet it was named by a German.

Fuck, yes it was! Here's what the OED says:

1913 J. LEWKOWITSCH Chem. Technol. of Oils I. iii. 211 Arachidonic Acid,
C20H32O2. The existence of an acid of this composition is inferred from
the formation of octo-bromo~arachidic acid... As Hartley has not named
this acid the author suggests the term arachidonic acid. 1924 L. G. WESSON
in Jrnl. Biol. Chem. LX. 183 Arachidonic acid, so named by Lewkowitsch, is
the tetra unsaturated, normal, aliphatic C20 acid, which is present in
brain tissue.

And who is this J. LEWKOWITSCH? Dr Julius Lewkowitsch, who is described by
some old edition of the Britannica thus:

LEWKOWITSCH, JULIUS (1857-1913), British chemist, was born at Ostrovo in
Prussian Silesia in 18J7. He graduated as doctor of philosophy at Breslau,
afterwards working in the Berlin agricultural high school and at
Heidelberg University. About 1888 he came to England and became a
naturalized British subject. He devoted much time to stereo-chemistry and
to developing the industrial technology of fats and oils, becoming the
first living authority in that branch of chemistry. He died at Chamonix
Sept. 18 1913

If you can get this, it's an obit in some chemical journal with more
detail:

http://www.rsc.org/delivery/_Article...JournalCode=AN

tom

--
Sometimes it takes a madman like Iggy Pop before you can SEE the logic
really working.
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  #13  
Old 07-23-2008, 03:34 AM
Taka
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Jul 22, 10:07 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
> > > The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
> > > stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
> > > substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
> > > this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
> > > Arachidonic Acid (AA).

>
> > That's in peanuts, right?

>
> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.
>
> Taka


Don't mistake arachidonic for arachidic, the latter is a saturated
fatty acid indeed found in peanut oil:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arachidic_acid

Taka
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  #14  
Old 07-23-2008, 06:43 AM
DZ
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 10:07 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>>>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>>>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>>>> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>>>> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>>>> Arachidonic Acid (AA).

>>
>>> That's in peanuts, right?

>>
>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
>> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
>> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.
>> Taka

>
> Don't mistake arachidonic for arachidic, the latter is a saturated
> fatty acid indeed found in peanut oil:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arachidic_acid


Don't mistake an Oxford biochemist for a Usenet blowhard who's
permanently high on Mead acid.
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  #15  
Old 07-23-2008, 06:43 AM
Andrzej Rosa
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

DZ wrote:

> Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>>> > The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>>> > stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>>> > substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>>> > this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>>> > Arachidonic Acid (AA).
>>>
>>> That's in peanuts, right?

>>
>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
>> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
>> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.
>> Taka

>
> No, Taka, you don't understand.
>
> Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
> Oxford.


It's so fortunate that you have nothing to do with KGB. It would be such a
shame if your beloved shrimp fed cat got lost due to a security breach in
some totally unrelated but conveniently nearby secret army founded research
facility...

> He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for peanuts.
> Get it? Arachi-donic.


Oh, we get it. Don't we?

--
Andrzej Rosa
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  #16  
Old 07-23-2008, 01:43 PM
Tom Anderson
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Tue, 22 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:

> On Jul 22, 10:07 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>>>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>>>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>>>> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>>>> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>>>> Arachidonic Acid (AA).
>>>
>>> That's in peanuts, right?

>>
>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
>> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
>> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.

>
> Don't mistake arachidonic for arachidic, the latter is a saturated
> fatty acid indeed found in peanut oil:


Aaah, that explains it. Cheers.

tom

--
We can only see a short distance ahead, but we can see plenty there that
needs to be done. -- Alan Turing
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  #17  
Old 07-23-2008, 05:15 PM
DZ
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> On Tue, 22 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>> On Jul 22, 10:07 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>>>>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>>>>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>>>>> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>>>>> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>>>>> Arachidonic Acid (AA).
>>>>
>>>> That's in peanuts, right?
>>>
>>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
>>> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
>>> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.

>>
>> Don't mistake arachidonic for arachidic, the latter is a saturated
>> fatty acid indeed found in peanut oil:

>
> Aaah, that explains it. Cheers.


"In 1854 [Charles Anthony Goessmann] discovered in the oil of the
groundnut (Arachis hypogaea) a new acid ... to which
he gave the name arachic (or arachidic) acid."

http://books.google.com/books?id=RQN...um=1&ct=result

So, arachidonic acid was discovered 55 years later.
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  #18  
Old 07-23-2008, 05:36 PM
Tom Anderson
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Wed, 23 Jul 2008, DZ wrote:

> Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>> On Tue, 22 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>>> On Jul 22, 10:07 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>>>>>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>>>>>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>>>>>> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>>>>>> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>>>>>> Arachidonic Acid (AA).
>>>>>
>>>>> That's in peanuts, right?
>>>>
>>>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
>>>> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
>>>> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.
>>>
>>> Don't mistake arachidonic for arachidic, the latter is a saturated
>>> fatty acid indeed found in peanut oil:

>>
>> Aaah, that explains it. Cheers.

>
> "In 1854 [Charles Anthony Goessmann]


Another German!

> discovered in the oil of the groundnut (Arachis hypogaea) a new acid ...
> to which he gave the name arachic (or arachidic) acid."
>
> http://books.google.com/books?id=RQN...um=1&ct=result
>
> So, arachidonic acid was discovered 55 years later.


Fair enough. I guess you can't read too much into a trivial name.

tom

--
We can only see a short distance ahead, but we can see plenty there that
needs to be done. -- Alan Turing
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  #19  
Old 07-24-2008, 05:38 AM
DZ
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
> DZ wrote:
>> No, Taka, you don't understand.
>>
>> Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
>> Oxford.

>
> It's so fortunate that you have nothing to do with KGB. It would be such a
> shame if your beloved shrimp fed cat got lost due to a security breach in
> some totally unrelated but conveniently nearby secret army founded research
> facility...
>
>> He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for peanuts.
>> Get it? Arachi-donic.

>
> Oh, we get it. Don't we?


Actually, Tom meant arachidic acid. It's only if you're from Oxford
that you can afford playing those "remind me what fats should I eat"
games, and then sit back and watch the fireworks.
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  #20  
Old 07-24-2008, 11:28 AM
Tom Anderson
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Thu, 24 Jul 2008, DZ wrote:

> Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> DZ wrote:
>>> No, Taka, you don't understand.
>>>
>>> Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
>>> Oxford. He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for
>>> peanuts. Get it? Arachi-donic.

>>
>> Oh, we get it. Don't we?

>
> Actually, Tom meant arachidic acid. It's only if you're from Oxford that
> you can afford playing those "remind me what fats should I eat" games,
> and then sit back and watch the fireworks.


Man, i don't get why some people are so excited by lipids. I don't think i
ever managed to stay awake through a whole lecture on lipids. It's even
more dull than sugar chemistry!

tom

--
Optical illusions are terrorism of the mind.
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  #21  
Old 07-24-2008, 01:58 PM
Taka
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Jul 24, 2:15 am, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> On Wed, 23 Jul 2008, DZ wrote:
> > Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> >> On Tue, 22 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
> >>> On Jul 22, 10:07 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> >>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
> >>>>>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
> >>>>>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
> >>>>>> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
> >>>>>> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
> >>>>>> Arachidonic Acid (AA).

>
> >>>>> That's in peanuts, right?

>
> >>>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
> >>>> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
> >>>> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.

>
> >>> Don't mistake arachidonic for arachidic, the latter is a saturated
> >>> fatty acid indeed found in peanut oil:

>
> >> Aaah, that explains it. Cheers.

>
> > "In 1854 [Charles Anthony Goessmann]

>
> Another German!


Actually, all great discoveries come originally from German or Russian
heads. The others like Jewish and Japanese are just masters of
stealing this intellectual property and making lot of money with
it ...

Taka

> > discovered in the oil of the groundnut (Arachis hypogaea) a new acid ...
> > to which he gave the name arachic (or arachidic) acid."

>
> >http://books.google.com/books?id=RQN...lpg=PA149&dq=a...

>
> > So, arachidonic acid was discovered 55 years later.

>
> Fair enough. I guess you can't read too much into a trivial name.
>
> tom
>
> --
> We can only see a short distance ahead, but we can see plenty there that
> needs to be done. -- Alan Turing


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  #22  
Old 07-24-2008, 01:58 PM
Andrzej Rosa
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Tom Anderson wrote:

> On Thu, 24 Jul 2008, DZ wrote:
>
>> Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> DZ wrote:
>>>> No, Taka, you don't understand.
>>>>
>>>> Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
>>>> Oxford. He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for
>>>> peanuts. Get it? Arachi-donic.
>>>
>>> Oh, we get it. Don't we?

>>
>> Actually, Tom meant arachidic acid. It's only if you're from Oxford that
>> you can afford playing those "remind me what fats should I eat" games,
>> and then sit back and watch the fireworks.

>
> Man, i don't get why some people are so excited by lipids.


Well, traditionally they are the main constituent of boobs. I still prefer
good old triglicerides to this newer silicones invention.

> I don't think i
> ever managed to stay awake through a whole lecture on lipids. It's even
> more dull than sugar chemistry!


Though I happen to like a good whisky.

--
Andrzej Rosa
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  #23  
Old 07-24-2008, 07:25 PM
Andrzej Rosa
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Taka wrote:

> On Jul 24, 2:15 am, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>>
>> Another German!

>
> Actually, all great discoveries come originally from German or Russian
> heads.


Germans at that time stole *everything* from Brits. That's why Tom is so
irked by them.

> The others like Jewish


Jews have about one third of Nobel Awards. Not bad for a nation of the size
of a grown up city. They are freaking geniuses, I'm afraid.

> and Japanese


A bit closer to reality, but they invented for example neutrinos.

> are just masters of
> stealing this intellectual property and making lot of money with
> it ...


Tom's not upset by the money Germans earned. Just that they didn't invent
neither Chemistry, nor industry, nor economy, but somehow he had to learn
all those funny sounding names. Anyway, Russians stole _a lot_ from the
West. They used to send their spies (not like DZ, of course, he is simply
well informed) to industrial conventions and simply buy stuff on a mass
scale to be reverse engineered and copied. At least that is what Victor
Suvorov wrote in his autobiographic book. He was one of those spies.

[...]
--
Andrzej Rosa
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  #24  
Old 07-25-2008, 05:58 AM
DZ
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> DZ wrote:
>> Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> DZ wrote:
>>>> No, Taka, you don't understand.
>>>>
>>>> Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
>>>> Oxford. He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for
>>>> peanuts. Get it? Arachi-donic.
>>>
>>> Oh, we get it. Don't we?

>>
>> Actually, Tom meant arachidic acid. It's only if you're from Oxford that
>> you can afford playing those "remind me what fats should I eat" games,
>> and then sit back and watch the fireworks.

>
> Man, i don't get why some people are so excited by lipids.


Not me man, no.
I'm not excited by lipids even the slightest.
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  #25  
Old 07-25-2008, 05:58 AM
Lucas Buck
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 05:21:09 -0700 (PDT), Taka <taka0038@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Jul 24, 2:15 am, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>> On Wed, 23 Jul 2008, DZ wrote:
>> > Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>> >> On Tue, 22 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>> >>> On Jul 22, 10:07 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>> On Jul 22, 8:25 pm, Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>> >>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008, Taka wrote:
>> >>>>>> The newest muscle booster is called "HemodrauliX" utilizing PGE2 to
>> >>>>>> stimulate nitric oxide synthase while supplementing it with enough
>> >>>>>> substrate in the form of Arginine. [...] How in the heck to did you do
>> >>>>>> this? You might ask. The answer is the addition of a compound called
>> >>>>>> Arachidonic Acid (AA).

>>
>> >>>>> That's in peanuts, right?

>>
>> >>>> No, only its precursor linoleic acid. It is in relatively high
>> >>>> amounts in organ meat such as hearts and egg yolks. Also in recently
>> >>>> mentioned farmed salmon fed grains.

>>
>> >>> Don't mistake arachidonic for arachidic, the latter is a saturated
>> >>> fatty acid indeed found in peanut oil:

>>
>> >> Aaah, that explains it. Cheers.

>>
>> > "In 1854 [Charles Anthony Goessmann]

>>
>> Another German!

>
>Actually, all great discoveries come originally from German or Russian
>heads.


This is often true, and it is precisely why I keep an assortment of
German and Russian heads in my basement laboratory.


>The others like Jewish and Japanese are just masters of
>stealing this intellectual property and making lot of money with
>it ...


And, of course, there is no such thing as a Russian or German _Jew_ in Taka's twistedly racist
world.

** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
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  #26  
Old 07-25-2008, 04:12 PM
DZ
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> This led to a celebrated bit of chip design: when Digital designed
> their then-cutting-edge CVAX processor, on a spare bit of the die,
> they wrote "CVAX: When you care enough to steal the very best" in
> Russian!
>
> http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/creature.../russians.html
> http://simh.trailing-edge.com/semi/cvax.html


In Russian, it doesn't make any sense though. It's just a bunch of
words put together:

"СВАКС... Когда вы забатите довольно воровать настоящий лучший"

"Забатите" is not even a Russian word, should be "Заботитесь".

If you translate back, it is "SVAX.. When you ??? enough steal genuine
better"
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  #27  
Old 07-29-2008, 11:47 PM
Lucas Buck
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Fri, 25 Jul 2008 15:22:05 +0000 (UTC), DZ <21767@3028312337.71354487.15072.31715.17391> wrote:

>Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>> This led to a celebrated bit of chip design: when Digital designed
>> their then-cutting-edge CVAX processor, on a spare bit of the die,
>> they wrote "CVAX: When you care enough to steal the very best" in
>> Russian!
>>
>> http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/creature.../russians.html
>> http://simh.trailing-edge.com/semi/cvax.html

>
>In Russian, it doesn't make any sense though. It's just a bunch of
>words put together:
>
>"?????... ????? ?? ???????? ???????? ???????? ????????? ??????"
>
>"????????" is not even a Russian word, should be "??????????".
>
>If you translate back, it is "SVAX.. When you ??? enough steal genuine
>better"


"Nothing sucks like a VAX", as those of us who worked on DEC UNIX used to quote.


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
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  #28  
Old 07-29-2008, 11:47 PM
Lucas Buck
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Fri, 25 Jul 2008 03:34:11 +0000 (UTC), DZ <21171@1406019478.94664202.11632.10160.20323> wrote:

>Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
>> DZ wrote:
>>> Andrzej Rosa <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> DZ wrote:
>>>>> No, Taka, you don't understand.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tom is one of our musclehead nerd scientists, a biochemist from
>>>>> Oxford. He refers to "Arachis hypogaea", which is geek talk for
>>>>> peanuts. Get it? Arachi-donic.
>>>>
>>>> Oh, we get it. Don't we?
>>>
>>> Actually, Tom meant arachidic acid. It's only if you're from Oxford that
>>> you can afford playing those "remind me what fats should I eat" games,
>>> and then sit back and watch the fireworks.

>>
>> Man, i don't get why some people are so excited by lipids.

>
>Not me man, no.
>I'm not excited by lipids even the slightest.


The clinical term for this is "homosexuality".


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
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  #29  
Old 07-30-2008, 01:50 AM
Taka
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: More use of arachidonic acid in bodybuilding

On Jul 26, 9:46 am, Lucas Buck <sbcp...@earthlink.NOSPAM.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 25 Jul 2008 15:22:05 +0000 (UTC), DZ <21...@3028312337.71354487.15072.31715.17391> wrote:
> >Tom Anderson <t...@urchin.earth.li> wrote:
> >> This led to a celebrated bit of chip design: when Digital designed
> >> their then-cutting-edge CVAX processor, on a spare bit of the die,
> >> they wrote "CVAX: When you care enough to steal the very best" in
> >> Russian!

>
> >>http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/creature.../russians.html
> >>http://simh.trailing-edge.com/semi/cvax.html

>
> >In Russian, it doesn't make any sense though. It's just a bunch of
> >words put together:

>
> >"?????... ????? ?? ???????? ???????? ???????? ????????? ??????"

>
> >"????????" is not even a Russian word, should be "?????