Training Week Ending 15 June 2008

Please feel free to reply with a summary of your week's workouts. Keep
it concise but provide an introduction/explanation as needed to explain
your own shorthand.

The weight is a kettlebell unless otherwise noted and "28: C&P/PU" means
a ladder format with a 28 kg bell of press left, press right, short
rest, pullup with the same weight on a belt, slightly longer rest, do
the next "rung" of the ladder, and take a long rest between ladders.
All one-armed movements done on both sides, of course.

NB: Program of light/medium/heavy presses and pullup is from Pavel's
"Enter The Kettlebell" and my goal is to first get to 28 kg x
(1,2,3,4,5) x 5 on heavy day, then be able to get a new 1RM on the
kettlebell strict press of 36 kg.

Mon 9 June:
military press, 28 kg C&P/PU ladder: (1,2,3) x 5 - medium day
32 kg - swings, 5L+5R, 3 sets

Tue 10 June
Getup: 32 kg x 1, 36 kg x 3
Windmill: 24 kg x 3

Wed 11 June
military press, 28 kg C&P/PU ladder: (1,2,3,4) x 2, (1,2,3) x 3 - heavy
day

Thu 12 June
Windmill: 24 kg x 3
8 bodyweight one-legged squats (butt to within 2-3" of ground)

Fri 13 June
military press, 28 kg C&P/PU ladder: (1,2) x 5 - light day - for last
set of pullups, instead of 2 reps @ 28 kg, 2 singles at 36 kg and 40 kg,
both pullup PR's
32 kg - swings, 5L+5R, 7 sets

Sat 14 June
wall-supported handstand hold: 30 seconds x 1
a few bw pistols

Sun 15 June
nothing

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

"Steve Freides" <steve@fridayscomputer.com> wrote in message
news:6blab3F3c975lU1@mid.individual.net...
> Please feel free to reply with a summary of your week's workouts. Keep it
> concise but provide an introduction/explanation as needed to explain your
> own shorthand.

I try to get to the gym at least 4 days a week. Mostly cardio these days but
trying to get full or upper body involved. Usually do about 30-40 minutes on
the C2 rower, then ridiculously light weights for about 30 minutes, and
maybe some more cardio on an elliptical or upper body ergometer.

"Steve Freides" <steve@fridayscomputer.com> wrote in message
news:6blab3F3c975lU1@mid.individual.net...
> Please feel free to reply with a summary of your week's workouts. Keep it
> concise but provide an introduction/explanation as needed to explain your
> own shorthand.

Hey Steve,
Got in my three days of free weights (plates & dumbbells) at home and
got my three rides in last week.
This week I have one day of arms and shoulders and one ride in.

I feel good about my self my sugar is way down and the BP is 110/62 with a
50 pulse.

Alive at 66 and feeling fine.

Burr

"Zen Cohen" <aturny@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:48570b26$0$31733$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>
> "Steve Freides" <steve@fridayscomputer.com> wrote in message
> news:6blab3F3c975lU1@mid.individual.net...
>> Please feel free to reply with a summary of your week's workouts.
>> Keep it concise but provide an introduction/explanation as needed to
>> explain your own shorthand.
>
> I try to get to the gym at least 4 days a week. Mostly cardio these
> days but trying to get full or upper body involved. Usually do about
> 30-40 minutes on the C2 rower, then ridiculously light weights for
> about 30 minutes, and maybe some more cardio on an elliptical or upper
> body ergometer.

I keep a log - I find it helps. What I posted is a shortened version of
that. Particularly since you're on the mend, you might find a written
record of how you're doing encouraging to look back on later. There are
any number of sites which will let you do this online for free - I keep
my own at home and also copy it up to an online log at DragonDoor. The
online logs at DragonDoor can be either public or private, so it needn't
be visible to anyone if you don't wish it to be.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

Dnia 2008-06-17 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
> "Zen Cohen" <aturny@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:48570b26$0$31733$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>>
>> "Steve Freides" <steve@fridayscomputer.com> wrote in message
>> news:6blab3F3c975lU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> Please feel free to reply with a summary of your week's workouts.
>>> Keep it concise but provide an introduction/explanation as needed to
>>> explain your own shorthand.
>>
>> I try to get to the gym at least 4 days a week. Mostly cardio these
>> days but trying to get full or upper body involved. Usually do about
>> 30-40 minutes on the C2 rower, then ridiculously light weights for
>> about 30 minutes, and maybe some more cardio on an elliptical or upper
>> body ergometer.
>
> I keep a log - I find it helps.

Well, I don't and I find it helps. ;-) Of course the biggest difference
is that I can't judge my progress by the amount of weight lifted. I
purposefully even don't count reps, sets and I don't even know how much
my weights actually weight.

But it all works too. Going by feel is an age old training strategy,
and it's useful especially if your primary training goal isn't in the
number of kilos lifted but in something else. In my case it's the way I
feel in the long term, but it was primarily used by bodybuilders of
"Golden Age". They cared for looks, not for numbers, but the underlying
idea was the same.

Anyway, for whatever it may be worth, I may describe what I was up to
last week. In general I train with two day split, one day is for lifting,
the other for some sort of auxiliary training. My lift day consists of
doing one "complex" until I had enough. It is one-armed clean and
behind the neck jerk, followed by one-armed overhead squat.

Oh my. It makes no sense to write all the details of what and why I'm
doing. It matters to me, but not to anybody else, so I skip it. Let's
just summarize some things I've learned.

1. If you want to heal your tendons, go for the itch. If after workout
your injured tendon itches to the point when you desperately want to
scratch it, under the skin and muscle, you did a great job!

2. Shoulders need both mobility and muscular balance. One without the
other doesn't do much for me, both together work. If you do a good job,
then taking a rest will not help. If you do what your shoulder needs to
heal itself, taking a rest means that you deprive yourself of this cure,
which should not help. If rest helps, you do something wrong, so search
for a better system.

> What I posted is a shortened version of
> that. Particularly since you're on the mend, you might find a written
> record of how you're doing encouraging to look back on later. There are
> any number of sites which will let you do this online for free - I keep
> my own at home and also copy it up to an online log at DragonDoor. The
> online logs at DragonDoor can be either public or private, so it needn't
> be visible to anyone if you don't wish it to be.

Sure, I believe that all these logs are fine, but not necessarily
necessary. It's possible to make progress without them. Maybe not
the best progress possible, but I'm not after a world record or
anything like that, so who cares?

BTW - I'm fairly pleased, because today I found out, that I can do
snatches again. Light, for now, but I can do them. And I can catch
them in an overhead squat, which I never was able to. You say that
static stretching doesn't work? Well, it seems to work for me.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

"Andrzej Rosa" <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:45hli5-eob.ln1@bakters.bandit.home...

>
> BTW - I'm fairly pleased, because today I found out, that I can do
> snatches again. Light, for now, but I can do them. And I can catch
> them in an overhead squat, which I never was able to. You say that
> static stretching doesn't work? Well, it seems to work for me.
>
> --
> Andrzej Rosa 1127R

As long as you're happy and feel good with yourself, and you sound happy.

How old are you now?

I'm 66 but I still follow a printed workout three days a week and I record
weight, rep's and sets.

I cycle on off days and I keep very good records there with something called
"CycliStats".

Have a happy, I'm ready for leg day today.

Burr

"Andrzej Rosa" <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:45hli5-eob.ln1@bakters.bandit.home...
> Dnia 2008-06-17 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
>> "Zen Cohen" <aturny@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:48570b26$0$31733$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>>>
>>> "Steve Freides" <steve@fridayscomputer.com> wrote in message
>>> news:6blab3F3c975lU1@mid.individual.net...
>>>> Please feel free to reply with a summary of your week's workouts.
>>>> Keep it concise but provide an introduction/explanation as needed
>>>> to
>>>> explain your own shorthand.
>>>
>>> I try to get to the gym at least 4 days a week. Mostly cardio these
>>> days but trying to get full or upper body involved. Usually do about
>>> 30-40 minutes on the C2 rower, then ridiculously light weights for
>>> about 30 minutes, and maybe some more cardio on an elliptical or
>>> upper
>>> body ergometer.
>>
>> I keep a log - I find it helps.
>
> Well, I don't and I find it helps. ;-) Of course the biggest
> difference
> is that I can't judge my progress by the amount of weight lifted. I
> purposefully even don't count reps, sets and I don't even know how
> much
> my weights actually weight.
>
> But it all works too. Going by feel is an age old training strategy,
> and it's useful especially if your primary training goal isn't in the
> number of kilos lifted but in something else. In my case it's the way
> I
> feel in the long term, but it was primarily used by bodybuilders of
> "Golden Age". They cared for looks, not for numbers, but the
> underlying
> idea was the same.
>
> Anyway, for whatever it may be worth, I may describe what I was up to
> last week. In general I train with two day split, one day is for
> lifting,
> the other for some sort of auxiliary training. My lift day consists
> of
> doing one "complex" until I had enough. It is one-armed clean and
> behind the neck jerk, followed by one-armed overhead squat.
>
> Oh my. It makes no sense to write all the details of what and why I'm
> doing. It matters to me, but not to anybody else, so I skip it.

No one is twisting your arm here, but other might benefit from a
description of what you do and why, e.g., if you post your age,
bodyweight, and the weight you use for one of your complexes along with
whatever set/rep scheme you're using, someone else might like to give it
a try.

> Let's
> just summarize some things I've learned.
>
> 1. If you want to heal your tendons, go for the itch. If after
> workout
> your injured tendon itches to the point when you desperately want to
> scratch it, under the skin and muscle, you did a great job!
>
> 2. Shoulders need both mobility and muscular balance. One without
> the
> other doesn't do much for me, both together work. If you do a good
> job,
> then taking a rest will not help. If you do what your shoulder needs
> to
> heal itself, taking a rest means that you deprive yourself of this
> cure,
> which should not help. If rest helps, you do something wrong, so
> search
> for a better system.

Life is rarely so simple, IMHO. I have a very sore left shoulder today
because I played upright bass a lot over the last few days after not
having played much at all for a few months. It wasn't just the bass
playing, it was the bass playing _after_ a few big lifting days. Big
lifting day Wed, big playing day Thu, another big lifting day Fri, and
another big playing day Sat, and now I have a sore left shoulder.

>> What I posted is a shortened version of
>> that. Particularly since you're on the mend, you might find a
>> written
>> record of how you're doing encouraging to look back on later. There
>> are
>> any number of sites which will let you do this online for free - I
>> keep
>> my own at home and also copy it up to an online log at DragonDoor.
>> The
>> online logs at DragonDoor can be either public or private, so it
>> needn't
>> be visible to anyone if you don't wish it to be.
>
> Sure, I believe that all these logs are fine, but not necessarily
> necessary. It's possible to make progress without them. Maybe not
> the best progress possible, but I'm not after a world record or
> anything like that, so who cares?
>
> BTW - I'm fairly pleased, because today I found out, that I can do
> snatches again. Light, for now, but I can do them. And I can catch
> them in an overhead squat, which I never was able to. You say that
> static stretching doesn't work? Well, it seems to work for me.

I have never said that static stretching doesn't work, only that it's
not the preferred method for most people, for most stretches, most of
the time. That doesn't mean it's always inappropriate, and it doesn't
preclude a rather broad definition of static stretching, either. One
static stretch I often do - I get into a side split and I read the
newspaper. One static stretch I avoid like the plague - a standing toe
touch.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

Dnia 2008-06-17 Burr napisa³(a):
>
> "Andrzej Rosa" <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:45hli5-eob.ln1@bakters.bandit.home...
>
>>
>> BTW - I'm fairly pleased, because today I found out, that I can do
>> snatches again. Light, for now, but I can do them. And I can catch
>> them in an overhead squat, which I never was able to. You say that
>> static stretching doesn't work? Well, it seems to work for me.
>>
>> --
>> Andrzej Rosa 1127R
>
> As long as you're happy and feel good with yourself, and you sound happy.

That's the best part, because I'm actually having my low tide now. But
I manage, it seems. That's why I'm so happy, because I shouldn't be.
Now I'm having some bad days, but not bad weeks or months, so I'm
actually having a life.

> How old are you now?

37

> I'm 66 but I still follow a printed workout three days a week and I record
> weight, rep's and sets.
>
> I cycle on off days and I keep very good records there with something called
> "CycliStats".

I tried that too, but I tended to overdo things, which wasn't working in
the grand scheme of things. Being more Tao than Buddhist works better.
If lifting is a tool, not the goal, we must treat it as a tool, not as
the goal.

> Have a happy, I'm ready for leg day today.

Best to you too.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

Dnia 2008-06-17 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
> "Andrzej Rosa" <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
>> Oh my. It makes no sense to write all the details of what and why I'm
>> doing. It matters to me, but not to anybody else, so I skip it.
>
> No one is twisting your arm here, but other might benefit from a
> description of what you do and why, e.g., if you post your age,

37

> bodyweight,

85 kg. I think. Well, several kilos more than in college, on the verge
of "overweight" BMI chart (but on a clear day I can see my abs, so I
shouldn't be considered overfat, I think).

> and the weight you use for one of your complexes

About 40kg something (42? 45? somewhere there). I'm using some home-made weights
which I had lying around for ages. I weighted them once, but I forgot
the exact numbers.

> along with whatever set/rep scheme you're using,

I do some warmup with lighter dumbbell (25? 30kg?) and then I simply go
right-left over and over until I've had "enough". Clean, behind the
neck jerk, overhead squat. Jerk is a joke, because behind the neck, if you
are using one arm, you don't have any "platform" to transform your leg
drive into a barbell, but I'm not trying to do a static press, so it's a
sort of a jerk. I rest between reps for however long it takes to be
"ready", which varies from day to day, but in general it doesn't take
long. I pace around for a moment and go at it again. Number of reps
will vary too, but from several per side on a bad day, to about 20 on a
good day with the weight which needs to be heavier. I do it about three
times a week. If I'm having more in the tank after that, I do some
auxiliaries. Various stuff chosen mostly on a whim, but they tend to
follow more of a traditional rep/set scheme.

> someone else might like to give it a try.

I wouldn't advise it to anyone. ;-) It's not a good way of building
mass, strength, probably even speed. I just happen to be able to do it
and enjoy it, so it's fine in this regard. And it's simple. You train
until you are tired. If the weight feels too light, you add some more.
It takes care of my mobility too, so it's fine for me.

>> Let's
>> just summarize some things I've learned.
>>
>> 1. If you want to heal your tendons, go for the itch. If after
>> workout
>> your injured tendon itches to the point when you desperately want to
>> scratch it, under the skin and muscle, you did a great job!
>>
>> 2. Shoulders need both mobility and muscular balance. One without
>> the
>> other doesn't do much for me, both together work. If you do a good
>> job,
>> then taking a rest will not help. If you do what your shoulder needs
>> to
>> heal itself, taking a rest means that you deprive yourself of this
>> cure,
>> which should not help. If rest helps, you do something wrong, so
>> search
>> for a better system.
>
> Life is rarely so simple, IMHO. I have a very sore left shoulder today
> because I played upright bass a lot over the last few days after not
> having played much at all for a few months. It wasn't just the bass
> playing, it was the bass playing _after_ a few big lifting days. Big
> lifting day Wed, big playing day Thu, another big lifting day Fri, and
> another big playing day Sat, and now I have a sore left shoulder.

Where exactly you don't agree with what I wrote? Because it seems like
you do.

>> Sure, I believe that all these logs are fine, but not necessarily
>> necessary. It's possible to make progress without them. Maybe not
>> the best progress possible, but I'm not after a world record or
>> anything like that, so who cares?
>>
>> BTW - I'm fairly pleased, because today I found out, that I can do
>> snatches again. Light, for now, but I can do them. And I can catch
>> them in an overhead squat, which I never was able to. You say that
>> static stretching doesn't work? Well, it seems to work for me.
>
> I have never said that static stretching doesn't work, only that it's
> not the preferred method for most people, for most stretches, most of
> the time. That doesn't mean it's always inappropriate, and it doesn't
> preclude a rather broad definition of static stretching, either. One
> static stretch I often do - I get into a side split and I read the
> newspaper. One static stretch I avoid like the plague - a standing toe

Fine. It seems like I didn't get you there. I just didn't like the
condemnation of static stretches, when world champions and gold
medalists are obviously using them on a regular basis. Not long ago
Hobbes posted a link to pictures of Chinese weightlifters, where they
showed some stretches. They have very good shoulder mobility.

--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R

"Andrzej Rosa" <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote

- Good stuff snipped, thank you. -

>>> 2. Shoulders need both mobility and muscular balance. One without
>>> the
>>> other doesn't do much for me, both together work. If you do a good
>>> job,
>>> then taking a rest will not help. If you do what your shoulder
>>> needs
>>> to
>>> heal itself, taking a rest means that you deprive yourself of this
>>> cure,
>>> which should not help. If rest helps, you do something wrong, so
>>> search
>>> for a better system.
>>
>> Life is rarely so simple, IMHO. I have a very sore left shoulder
>> today
>> because I played upright bass a lot over the last few days after not
>> having played much at all for a few months. It wasn't just the bass
>> playing, it was the bass playing _after_ a few big lifting days. Big
>> lifting day Wed, big playing day Thu, another big lifting day Fri,
>> and
>> another big playing day Sat, and now I have a sore left shoulder.
>
> Where exactly you don't agree with what I wrote? Because it seems
> like
> you do.

"If rest helps, you do something wrong, so search for a better system."

I disagree with that. I am currently resting my sore shoulder and it's
getting better quickly. For people who push themselves hard in
training, even those like me who do it only some of the time, overuse
injuries do happen. The trick, at least for me, is to recognize such
injuries early enough that you stop and recuperate before you do
permanent damage. I know in a few more days how my shoulder is doing,
but in the meantime, after a big workout on Monday, I did no lifting
Tuesday, and this morning I am going for a massage followed by another
day without lifting.

Basically, the price one pays for overuse is that one must follow it by
underuse to even out the karma.

>>> Sure, I believe that all these logs are fine, but not necessarily
>>> necessary. It's possible to make progress without them. Maybe not
>>> the best progress possible, but I'm not after a world record or
>>> anything like that, so who cares?
>>>
>>> BTW - I'm fairly pleased, because today I found out, that I can do
>>> snatches again. Light, for now, but I can do them. And I can catch
>>> them in an overhead squat, which I never was able to. You say that
>>> static stretching doesn't work? Well, it seems to work for me.
>>
>> I have never said that static stretching doesn't work, only that it's
>> not the preferred method for most people, for most stretches, most of
>> the time. That doesn't mean it's always inappropriate, and it
>> doesn't
>> preclude a rather broad definition of static stretching, either. One
>> static stretch I often do - I get into a side split and I read the
>> newspaper. One static stretch I avoid like the plague - a standing
>> toe
>
> Fine. It seems like I didn't get you there. I just didn't like the
> condemnation of static stretches, when world champions and gold
> medalists are obviously using them on a regular basis. Not long ago
> Hobbes posted a link to pictures of Chinese weightlifters, where they
> showed some stretches. They have very good shoulder mobility.

The devil is in the details. The problem with static stretching is that
people often apply it to postures where it is ill-advised. For those
wishing to improve their mobility, some sort of contract/relax protocol,
which of course entails its own risks, is still the best route to
progress. The very, very good thing about a book like Pavel's "Relax
Into Stretch" is that a lot of the thinking has been done for you.
There are enough stretches given, along with the protocols for each and
suggestions about combining them into a stretching schedule/routine,
that one can follow the book with confidence knowing the risks have been
minimized and the chances for success maximized by someone who knows the
subject well. http://www.kbnj.com/ris.htm for the book.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

Dnia 2008-06-18 Steve Freides napisa³(a):
> "Andrzej Rosa" <bakters@yahoo.com> wrote
>
>>> Life is rarely so simple, IMHO. I have a very sore left shoulder
>>> today
>>> because I played upright bass a lot over the last few days after not
>>> having played much at all for a few months. It wasn't just the bass
>>> playing, it was the bass playing _after_ a few big lifting days. Big
>>> lifting day Wed, big playing day Thu, another big lifting day Fri,
>>> and
>>> another big playing day Sat, and now I have a sore left shoulder.
>>
>> Where exactly you don't agree with what I wrote? Because it seems
>> like
>> you do.
>
> "If rest helps, you do something wrong, so search for a better system."
>
> I disagree with that. I am currently resting my sore shoulder and it's
> getting better quickly.

But you did something wrong, didn't you? You overworked it.

> For people who push themselves hard in
> training, even those like me who do it only some of the time, overuse
> injuries do happen. The trick, at least for me, is to recognize such
> injuries early enough that you stop and recuperate before you do
> permanent damage. I know in a few more days how my shoulder is doing,
> but in the meantime, after a big workout on Monday, I did no lifting
> Tuesday, and this morning I am going for a massage followed by another
> day without lifting.
>
> Basically, the price one pays for overuse is that one must follow it by
> underuse to even out the karma.

Well, yeah. And you need to pay back several times more than you
borrowed. One week of overuse often equals several weeks of required
babying.

[...]
--
Andrzej Rosa 1127R